Jan 17, 2023 Carmel Plan Commission

[A. Call Meeting to Order]

[B. Pledge of Allegiance]

[00:00:10]

WE WILL BE IN ORDER. I ASK THAT WE ALL RISE FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. THANK YOU.

[C. Roll Call]

>> DUBBIE BUCKLER? >> HERE.

BOSTON ADAM CAMPAGNA? >> PRESENT.

LEO DEREKMAN? R DIERCKMAN?

JOSH HIRSH? >> PRESENT.

SUSAN WESTERMEIER? >> PRESENT.

[D. Declaration of Quorum]

PRESIDENT GRABOW? >> PRESENT.

>> WE HAVE A QUORUM. WE WILL TABLE APLEUFL OF THE MINUTES OF THE DECEMBER MEETING FOR LACK OF A QUORUM ON THAT PARTICULAR VOTE. SOME ANTICIPATED ABSTENTIONS WERE TO BE PART OF THAT VOTE. WE WILL TAKE THAT UP AT OUR

[F. Communications, Bills, Expenditures, & Legal Counsel Report]

>> NOTHING TO REPORT. >> GREAT, THANK YOU.

WE HAVE TWO NEW MEMBERS TO SWEAR IN UNLESS THOSE OATHS HAVE BEEN TAKEN OUTSIDE THIS MEETING. OKAY.

GREAT. THANK YOU.

THEN WE WILL MOVE TO ELECTION OF OFFICERS AND OTHER POSITIONS FOR CALL EDGE CAR, 2023. STARTING WITH ELECTION OF PRESIDENT OF THE PLAN COMM COMMISSION.

I'LL OPEN THE FLOOR TO NOMINATIONS.

>> I NOMINATE BRAD GRABOW. >> I'LL SECOND.

I'LL CLOSE THE NOMINATIONS. >> THANK YOU BOTH.

ALL IN FAVOR OF CLOSING THE FLOOR OF NOMINATION, SAY AYE.

>> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? THE FLOOR IS CLOSED. WE WILL MOVE TO THE VOTE.

ALL IN FAVOR OF MYSELF AS PRESIDENT, SAY AYE.

>> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? THANK YOU. THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH.

ELECTION OF VICE PRESIDENT. >> I NOMINATE CHRISTINE ZOCCOLA.

>> SECOND. >> ARE THERE ANY OTHER NOMINATIONS? A MOTION TO CLOSE THE FLOOR TO

NOMINATIONS? >> MOTION TO CLOSE.

>> THANK YOU. ALL IN FAVOR OF CLOSING THE

FLOOR OF NOMINATIONS, SAY AYE. >> AYE.

>> FLOOR IS CLOSED. TO THE NOMINATION TO THE ELECTION. CHRISTINE AS VICE PRESIDENT.

ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? CHRISTINE, THANK YOU.

THERE IS NO VACANCY FOR THE COMMISSION'S REPRESENTATIVE ON THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS. ELECTION OF MEMBER TO THE HAMILTON COUNTY PLAN COMMISSION WHEN THAT BODY MEETS WHICH IF MEMORY SERVE, DID NOT OCCUR AT ALL IN 2022.

TRADITION HAS IT THAT THE MOST JUNIOR MEMBER OF THE COMMISSION SERE IN THAT ROLE. LY NOMINATE WILL CAMPAGNA?

>> I'LL SECOND. >> ANY OTHER NOMINATIONS? GOOD POINT. HEARING NONE, THEN WE WILL CLOSE THE FLOOR OF NOMINATIONS. WE WILL PROCEED WITH THE ELECTION OF MR. CAMPAGNA AS OUR REPRESENTATIVE TO THE PLAN COMMISSION. ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.

>> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? THANK YOU, ADAM. AND ELECTION OF A MEMBER AT LARGE TO THE EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE.

THAT BODY CONSISTS OF THE PRESIDENT, THE VICE PRESIDENT, OUR TWO COMMITTEE CHAIRS AND THIS AT-LARGE POSITION.

THE FLOOR IS OPEN TO NOMINATIONS.

>> I NOMINATE JOSHUA KIRSH. >> I'LL SECOND.

>> ANY OTHER NOMINATIONS? MOTION CLOSED.

THANK YOU. ALL IN FAVOR OF CLOSING THE FLOOR OF NOMINATIONS. SAY AYE.

>> AYE. >> WITH THE ELECTION, ALL IN FAVOR OF JOSH KIRSH AS THE MEMBER AT LARGE OF THE EXECUTIVE

COMMITTEE, SAY AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT.

MR. KIRSH, IT IS. THANK YOU FOR THAT HOUSEKEEPING EXERCISE. WE NEXT HAVE THREE PLAN COMMISSION RESOLUTIONS TO BE PRESENTED BY... THERE HE IS.

MR. DONALDSON. THEY ARE RESOLUTIONS PC-01-17-23A. CRC RESOLUTION NUMBER 2022-34.

THIRD AVENUE, AT&T ALLOCATION AREA WITHIN THE EXISTING ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREA. RESOLUTION PC-01-17-23B.

RESOLUTION NUMBER 2022,-35, CROSSING ONE AND CROSSING TWO

[00:05:01]

111 PENN REDEVELOPMENT AREA. MR. DONALDSON?

>> THANK YOU. GOOD EVENING.

WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO COVER ALL THREE OR TAKE THEM ONE AT A

TIME? >> LET'S TRY THE BULK APPROACH.

>> OKAY. WE WILL TRY.

THAT I'LL BE HAPPY TO TAKE ANY QUESTIONS.

THE FIRST ONE IS THE THIRD AVENUE ATT ALLOCATION AREA.

THESE ALL COME FROM THE CRCC, AS YOU HAVE SEEN MANY TIMES IN THE PAST. WHENEVER THE CRC PROPOSES TO EITHER CREATE OR AMEND AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREA OR REDEVELOPMENT AREA IN THE CITY, THEY HAVE TO COME TO THE PLAN COMMISSION FOR APPROVAL THAT WHAT THEY ARE PLANNING TO DO FALLS WITHIN THE PLAN OF DEVELOPMENT FOR THE CITY.

SO THIS FIRST ONE, THIS IS AN EXPANSION OF THE EXISTING OLD MERIDIEN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREA AND THE CREATION OF A NEW TIF ALLOCATION AREA FOR THIS THIRD AVENUE ATT PROJECT.

IT ALSO AMENDS THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PLAN TO ADD IT.

IT IS A MIXED-USE PROJECT THAT INVOLVES SOME MULTIFAMILY AND SOME OFFICE HEADQUARTERS. YOU CAN SEE HERE WHERE THE LOCATION IS, SO THAT IS PRETTY STRAIGHT FORWARD.

THAT IS THE PROPOSAL COMING FROM THE CRC ON THAT ONE.

THE SECOND ONE IS WHAT WE ARE CALLING CROSSING ONE AND CROSSING TWO ALLOCATION AREAS. THIS IS IN AN EXISTING 126TH STREET ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREA AND AN EXISTING 126TH STREET TIF ALLOCATION AREA. THE PROPOSAL IS TO TAKE THESE TWO SITES OUT OF THE EXISTING ALLOCATION AREA AND CREATE NEW STAND-ALONE ALLOCATION AREAS THAT WOULD RELATE SPECIFICALLY TO THESE REPUBLIC PROJECTS, AND THE FIRST ONE, CROSSING ONE WOULD BE TO HELP THE CRC HELP INCENTIVIZE THE CORPORATE HEADQUARTERS DEVELOPMENT, AND THEN THE CROSSING TWO PIECE WOULD BE FOR A PARKING GRAM GARAGE THAT WOULD BE WRAPPED WITH MULTIFAMILY AND RETAIL. SO THAT IS THE PROPOSAL FOR THE SECOND RESOLUTION. THE THIRD RESOLUTION IS ALSO IN THE EXISTING 126TH STREET CORRIDOR.

ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREA AND TIF ALLOCATION AREA.

THE PROPOSAL HERE IS TO TAKE THIS SITE OUT OF BOTH OF THOSE AND CREATE A BRAND NEW REDEVELOPMENT AREA AND A NEW REDEVELOPMENT PLAN FOR THIS S SITE.

NO PROPOSAL AT THIS POINT TO CREATE ANY TIF ALLOCATION AREAS.

THAT WOULD COME LATER. AS THE PROJECT IS FURTHER DEFINED. IN EACH STAGE OF THE PROJECT.

THERE WOULD BE MORE THAN ONE ALLOCATION AREA PROPOSED.

WE WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK THROUGH THE SAME PROCESS FOR THAT APPROVAL. RIGHT NOW IT IS JUST THE CREATION OF A NEW REDEVELOPMENT AIR QUARRY AND PLAN RELATED TO THAT. IF YOU APPROVE THESE RESOLUTIONS TONIGHT, THEY WOULD ALL GO TO THE CITY COUNCIL.

FOR THEIR REVIEW. IF THE COUNCIL APPROVES, IT GOES BACK TO THE CRC FOR A FINAL PUBLIC HEARING AND CONFIRMATION.

SO WITH THAT, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO TAKE ANY QUESTIONS.

>> THANK YOU, BRUCE. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. DONALDSON FROM THE PLAN COMMISSION? IS THERE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE THREE RESOLUTIONS?

>> MOVE ADOPTION OF THE THREE RESOLUTIONS AS PRESENTED.

>> THANK YOU FOR THE MOTION. >> SECOND.

>> MR. DIERCKMAN, SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR, SIGNIFY BY SAYING

AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? GREAT.

ALL ARE ADOPTED. THANK YOU, BRUCE.

[G. Reports, Announcements & Department Concerns]

RACHEL? >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

JUST TO GO OVER THE OUTCOME OF THE PROJECTS AT COMMITTEE, AT THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE, WE HAD THE 116TH RANGELINE PROJECT.

THAT WAS TABLED TO BE HEARD TONIGHT INSTEAD OF AT THAT COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE, ACTUALLY. THEY ARE HERE TONIGHT.

AND THE SECOND ITEM WAS THE ROSIE'S GARDEN ZONE.

THAT WAS FORWARDED TO THE CITY COUNCIL WITH A FAVORABLE RECOMMENDATION. THE RESIDENTIAL COMMITTEE HAD NO ITEMS IN JANUARY, AND THEN THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE, WE ARE

[00:10:05]

>> OKAY. COULD YOU CLARIFY... OR I GUESS I COULD ASK THE COMMITTEE CHAIR WHY THE 116TH AND RANGELINE WAS RETURNED TO THE COMMISSION WITHOUT ACTION?

>> SO IT WAS NOT HEARD AT ALL. IT WAS TABLED TO ALLOW FOR MORE TIME TO WORK WITH THE PETITIONER AND STAFF INSTEAD OF GOING ALL THE WAY TO THE NEXT MONTH'S COMMITTEE, THEY WANTED TO COME HERE. SO THEY WILL BE TONIGHT AS OLD BUSINESS INSTEAD OF GOING TO THE FEBRUARY COMMITTEE.

>> OKAY. SO COUNSELOR, WE PREVIOUSLY PASSED A MOTION TO SEND THAT TO THE COMMITTEE FOR ACTION, ALTHOUGH I BELIEVE WE DID WITHHOLD FINAL APPROVAL AUTHORITY TO THIS BODY. DO WE NEED TO DO ANYTHING TO UNWIND THAT MOTION OR THAT COURSE OF ACTION?

>> I JUST HAVE A FOLLOW-UP QUESTION TO RACHEL, ACTUALLY.

I WASN'T THERE FOR THIS SPECIFIC ONE.

JUST FOR CLARIFICATION PURPOSES, COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE OR WAS THAT

ITEM NOT HEARD AT ALL? >> THE ITEM WAS NOT HEARD AT

ALL. >> I SEE.

IN THAT CASE, IT STILL REMAINS IN THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE UNLESS YOU RECALL IT. IT IS WITHIN YOUR POWERS TO BRING IT BACK IN FRONT OF THE PLAN COMMISSION, BUT AS IT WASN'T MOVED OUT OF THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE, BY COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE ITSELF, THE ONLY WAY FOR IT TO BE HEARD HERE

IS TO RECALL IT. >> PERFECT.

THANK YOU. IS THERE A MOTION TO RECALL THIS DOCKET FROM THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE?

>> MOVE TO RECALL. >> SECOND.

>> THANK YOU BOTH. ALL IN FAVOR OF RECALLING THIS FROM THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE, SO IT CAN BE HEARD TONIGHT HERE,

SAY AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT.

VERY GOOD. THANK YOU MR. GRECHUKHIN.

[H. Public Hearings]

B.J.'S WHOLESALE CLUB AMENDMENT. THE APPLICANT SEEKS TO AMEND THE PUD TO ADD ACCESSORY USES AND TO UPDATE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS REQUIREMENTS TO CLUB BUILDING.

THE SITE LOCATED AT 14480 LOWES WAY.

THE ORDINANCE IS CURRENTLY PUD. 146TH AND KEYSTONE AVENUE.

THE PETITION HAS BEEN FILED BY MARK LAVOIE OF BJ'S WHOLESALE, INC. IS MR. LAVOIE PRESENTING TONIGHT? MR. HARDEN? ALL RIGHT. THE FLOOR IS YOURS, GENTLEMAN, FOR 15 MINUTES. OUR RULES OF PUBLIC HEARING PROVIDE FOR A 15-PLANT PRESENTATION BY THE PETITIONER FOLLOWED BY UP TO 20 MINUTES FOR PUBLIC COMMENT.

THE PETITIONER THEN HAS FIVE MINUTES TO RESPOND TO THOSE COMMENTS. THEN THE DEPARTMENT REPORT IS PRESENTED AT WHICH POINT, THE PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED, AND WE CONTINUE WITH THE COMMISSION DISCUSSION AT THAT POINT.

SO UP TO 15 MINUTES, IF YOU NEED THEM ALL, STEVE.

>> THANK YOU, MR. PRESIDENT. GOOD EVENING.

FOR THE RECORD, MY NAME IS STEVE HARDEN.

I'M PLEASED TO BE HERE REPRESENTING THE REALTY GROUP AND B.J.'S WHOLE CLUB. HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE.

CONGRATULATIONS TO THOSE ELECTED TONIGHT TO YOUR POSITIONS.

I GOT MARK JENKINS AND GENE HERE TONIGHT FROM B.J.'S WHOLE CLUB.

HOPEFULLY, WE HAVE MOST OF THE PEOPLE HERE TO ANSWER THE QUESTIONS THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE FOR US.

WE WANT TO THANK RACHEL AND HER TEAM.

WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH THEM FOR SEVERAL MONTHS.

ON THE SITE PLAN. AND SO HOPEFULLY, THE STAFF REPORT INDICATED THAT AS WELL. AND WE HAVE SOME CONTINUED WORK THAT WE ARE DOING WITH RACHEL. THIS PUD ORDINANCE COVERS THE ACREAGE HERE. THIS IS THE LOWES.

THIS IS 146TH STREET. THIS IS THE KEYSTONE CORRIDOR.

THIS IS LOWES WAY. AND THE TEN ACRES THAT WE ARE HERE TONIGHT ON IS THE SOUTHERN TEN ACRES.

WHEN THIS ORDINANCE ORIGINALLY WAS PROPOSED BACK IN 2000 WITH THE TEAM, BY THE WAY, FOR SOME OF YOU WHO AREN'T FAMILIAR WITH THE REALTY GROUP, THEY HAVE A NUMBER OF EXCITING PROJECTS GOING ON HERE IN CARMEL RIGHT NOW.

116TH AND RANGELINE. AND THE PUBLIC AIRWAYS PROJECT.

WE ARE INVOLVED WITH THAT, TOO. THE REALTY GROUP HAS BEEN

[00:15:03]

THEY WENT FORWARD. THE ORIGINAL ANCHOR WAS NOT READY TO MOVE FORWARD. TWO RESTAURANT BUILDINGS WERE BUILT. ONE IS VACANT.

THERE IS 16,000 SQUARE FEET BETWEEN THOSE TWO BUILDINGS.

ONE HAS BEEN VACANT FOR A WHILE. IN WORKING WITH THE CITY LEADERSHIP ON WHAT WOULD BE BEST TO DO TO REDEVELOP THE SITE BECAUSE IT IS CURRENTLY BEING UNDERUTILIZED, EVENTUALLY, THE TEAM DECIDED TO PARTNER UP WITH THE B.J.'S WHOLESALE CLUB TEAM, AND THAT IS WHAT THEN BEGAN THE PROCESS OF TALKING WITH CITY LEADERSHIP AND THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT AND BROUGHT US HERE TODAY. MOST OF THE AMENDMENTS THAT YOU WILL SEE, THERE IS ABOUT TEN OR SO AMENDMENTS.

FOUR OF THOSE ARE SPECIFICALLY REQUESTED BY EITHER THE PLANNINE ALTERNATE TRANSPORTATION DEPARTMENT OR THE URBAN TORE FORESTER. A HANDFUL OF THE AMENDMENTS ARE SITE-SPECIFIC ISSUES FOR THIS PARTICULAR F PROJECT.

ONE OF THEM HAS TO DO WITH THE FACT THAT WHEN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY WAS ACQUIRED, YOU HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK AT OUR PACKET.

YOU MIGHT HAVE SEEN SOME OF THE EXHIBITS RELATED TO THE ROAD IMPROVEMENTS, AND SO THIS ONE IS FROM RIGHT HERE, FOR EXAMPLE.

THIS IS 2004. HERE IS 2000 WHEN THE PUD ORDINANCE WAS APPROVED. LOWES WAY WAS NOT YET% CONSTRUCTED. OBVIOUSLY, THE LOWES BUILDING WASN'T CONSTRUCTED YET. HERE IS 2004, SHOWING THE LOWES BUILDING IN THE BEGINNING PARTS OF LOWES WAY.

THEN OVER HERE WE'VE GOT 2013. I'M SORRY.

2012. WHICH IS SHOWING YOU THE AREA WHERE THE RIGHT OF BAY TAKING WAS UNDER WAY.

THEN THE FOLLOWING YEAR, AROUND 2013, THE ROAD IMPROVEMENTS HERE CAME IN, AND THERE WAS A RIGHT-OF-WAY TAKING BY THE STATE FOR THE ROAD IMPROVEMENTS, AND THAT GOBBLED UP SOME OF THE LAND THAT HAD BEEN PREVIOUSLY IN THE ORIGINAL PUD ORDINANCE THAT, HAD SOME BUFFER AREAS IN IT. AND SO PART OF THE PUD ORDINANCE UPDATE HERE IS TO JUST ACCOMMODATE FOR THE FACT THAT THERE IS NO LONGER... THERE IS A PARKING LOT.

THERE WAS 30 FEET BEFORE BETWEEN THE PARKING LOT AND THE RIGHT-OF-WAY, AND THE STATE ACQUIRED THAT RIGHT-OF-WAY.

WE ARE CLEANING THAT UP. THAT WASN'T MUCH OF A SUBSTANTIVE CHANGE OTHER THAN AN UPDATE TO CLEAN UP THE ORDINANCE ITSELF. IN WORKING WITH THE STAFF, YOU SAW IN THE STAFF REPORT, THERE IS A NUMBER OF THINGS IN THERE IN BOLD, PARTICULARLY, THAT WERE SOME THINGS WE GOT FROM THE STAFF REPORT OF THINGS THAT RACHEL ASKED US TO CONTINUE TO WORK ON WITH HER. AND SINCE WE RECEIVED THE STAFF REPORT THERE, HAS BEEN SOME... A NUMBER OF THOSE HAVE BEEN RESPONDED TO AND UPDATED. AND WE WILL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH RACHEL BETWEEN NOW AND GOING TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE. PARTICULARLY, ON THE ARCHITECTURAL COMMENTS AND THE SIGNAGE.

BUT WE PROVIDED THE ADDITIONAL UPDATES TO HER THAT SHE HAD REQUESTED. WE DID HAVE A NEIGHBOR MEETING AT THE END OF NOVEMBER. AND THE NOTICE WENT OUT TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD. PRIMARILY, THE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD TO THE EAST, AND NO ONE DECIDED TO JOIN US.

WE HAVEN'T HAD ANY CALLS EITHER. FROM ANYBODY ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT IT. WE CHECKED WITH THE STAFF, AND THEY HAVEN'T EITHER YET. WE ARE HAPPY TO TALK TO ANYBODY.

IF THEY DO DECIDE THEY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.

ONE OF THE KEY THINGS ABOUT THE PROJECT AS WELL ARE SOME OF THE ROAD IMPROVEMENTS THAT ARE BEING PROPOSED.

I WILL SHOW YOU THOSE. SO IF ANYBODY DRIVES THIS AREA, PARTICULARLY, GOING NORTHBOUND ON LOWES WAY, YOU MIGHT HAVE EXPERIENCED FIRSTHAND SOME OF THE CHALLENGES OUT THERE TODAY.

THAT THIS PROJECT IS HOPING TO BE ABLE TO HELP ALLEVIATE.

CURRENTLY, GOING NORTHBOUND ON LOWES WAY, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF... THERE ARE FOUR LANES HEADING NORTH.

TWO ARE DEDICATED LEFT TURN. THERE IS ONE IN THE MIDDLE THAT IS A THROUGH LANE. AND THEN THE OTHER ONE CURRENTLY IS A RIGHT-TURN ONLY LANE. AND THEN ACROSS THE STREET, GOING NORTH, THERE IS CURRENTLY ONLY ONE LANE HEADING NORTH.

AND SO ONE OF THE KEY THINGS THAT THE TRAFFIC ENGINEERS AND THE PEOPLE THAT ARE SMARTER THAN I AM ABOUT THESE ISSUES, WHAT THEY IDENTIFIED WAS THAT IT WOULD HELP ALLEVIATE THE TRAFFIC. PEOPLE ARE BACKING UP IN THE ONE LANE THAT CAN GO THROUGH THE INTERSECTION, THAT LANE IS BACKING UP SOMETIMES DURING RUSH HOUR TIME BACK TO THE ROUND-ABOUT. AND IF THERE WAS AN ADDITIONAL THROUGH LANE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF 146TH STREET, AND THEN IF WE MADE THIS EXISTING RIGHT TURN ONLY LANE, BOTH A THROUGH LANE AND A RIGHT TURN LANE, THAT WOULD PROVIDE TWO LANES NOW THAT PEOPLE COULD BE IN TO FILL THE DESIRE TO GO NORTHBOUND ACROSS THE INTERSECTION. THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE DEVELOPMENT TEAM HAS WORKED WITH THE COUNTY TO GET THEIR OKAY, TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT IMPROVEMENT ACROSS THE STREET IN

[00:20:01]

ONE OF THE OTHER CHALLENGES THAT SOMETIMES HAS HAPPENED WITH TRAFFIC FLOW IS THE ONLY WAY... THERE IS ONE WAY OUT TODAY.

IF YOU WANT TO GO SOUTHBOUND, THERE IS NOT A DEDICATED TURN LANE SOUTHBOUND TO KEEP THAT DRIVER OUT OF THE ROUND-ABOUT.

AND SO AS PART OF THE PROPOSAL, THE TEAM ARE PROPOSING A DEDICATED RIGHT TURN LANE THAT WOULD COME OUT A SLIP LANE.

ANYONE THAT WANTED TO COME OUT OF THE CENTER AND GO SOUTHBOUND, WILL NOT HAVE TO GO INTO THE ROUNDABILITY.

THAT IS ANTICIPATED TO HELP ALLEVIATE... TO MINIMIZE ADDITIONAL IMPACT ON THE ROUNDABOUT ITSELF.

FINALLY, AT THE SOUTH END, THERE WOULD BE A RIGHT TURN ONLY EXIT FROM THE SITE AT THE SOUTH SOUTHBOUND... THE SOUTH PART OF THE PROJECT. SO THOSE ARE THE MAJOR ISSUES.

WE DO HAVE, AGAIN, UPDATES IN THE PUD ORDINANCE.

THE AMENDMENTS INCLUDE SPECIFICALLY PROVIDING FOR THE FUEL STATION, THE STAFF ASKED US AND THE CITY LEADERSHIP ASKED US AT THE VERY BEGINNING. THEY SAID HEY, WE HAVE DONE A COUPLE OF OTHER RECENT... RECENT BEING THE LAST FIVE YEARS OR SO FUEL STATION THAT IS HAVE HAD SOME SPECIFIC ABOVE AND BEYOND TYPE OF STANDARDS TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL PROTECTION.

THAIP SAID PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU INCORPORATE THOSE.

THE TEAM LOOKED BACK AND WORKED WITH RACHEL ON WHAT THOSE WERE.

YOU WILL SEE A SET OF STANDARDS IN THE PUD ORDINANCE.

RACHEL INDICATED THAT WE ARE STILL WAITING TO HEAR BACK FROM ENGINEERING IF THEY HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT. WE WILL BE HAPPY TO WORK WITH THEM WITH RESPECT TO THAT. THEN WE MENTIONED THE GREEN BELT MODIFICATION. THEN WE HAVE PARKING.

SPECIFIC PARKING STANDARDS TO ACCOMMODATE THE EXACT PLAN THAT WE HAVE. THEN WE HAVE SIGNAGE ALSO AND ARCHITECTURE THAT WE STILL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH.

WE ANTICIPATE A VERY POSITIVE RESOLUTION TO BOTH OF THOSE TOPICS BY THE TIME WE GET TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE.

WE ARE PUTTING THAT ON THE RECORD, RACHEL, TONIGHT.

WE HAVE A LOT OF LEVERAGE WITH US TO HOPEFULLY HAVE US WORK THE WAY YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE US DO THAT.

WITH THAT, WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU HAVE FOR US. OR ANY HOMEWORK TO ADDRESS AT THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU, MR. HARDEN. PUBLIC COMMENT IS NEXT ON OUR AGENDA. COULD I SEE A SHOW OF HANDS OF ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK EITHER IN OPPOSITION OR IN SUPPORT OF THIS PETITION? I SEE NONE.

THEN WE WILL PROCEED TO THE DEPARTMENT REPORT.

RACHEL? >> THANK YOU.

FOR THE RECORD, RACHEL KEYSLING, PLANNER WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES. AS WE HAVE HEARD TONIGHT, PETITIONER PROPOSES TO MAKE CHANGES TO AN EXISTING PUD IN ORDER TO ALLOW FOR A NEW DEVELOPMENT AT THE B.J.'S WHOLESALE CLUB. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH THE PETITIONER TO ADDRESS SITE LAYOUT AND BUILDING DESIGN CONCERNS. AS THE CONCEPT PLAN AND ELEVATIONS THAT ARE PROPOSED WITH THIS PUD AMENDMENT ARE INTENDED TO BE CONSTRUCTED WITH DEVELOPMENT PLAN AND ADLS REQUESTS FOLLOWING THE ORDINANCE AMENDMENT IF APPROVED.

ONE OF THE MAJOR CONCERNS WE HAD INITIALLY WAS AROUND THE LOCATION OF THE GAS STATION COMPONENT OF THIS PROJECT.

AND THE CONCERN WAS THAT IT WAS VERY CLOSE TO THE CREEK WHICH RUNS SOUTH OF THIS PROPERTY. SO WE TRIED TO WORK TO GET IT AS FAR AWAY FROM THE CREEK AS POSSIBLE WHILE NOT IMPEDING THE FLOW OF THE SITE CIRCULATION, AND KEEPING PROPER DISTANCE AWAY FROM THE NEIGHBORHOODS TO THE EAST.

OF LOWES KRP WAY. WE WORKED TOGETHER ON THE LOCATION OF THE PUMPS AND UNDERGROUND STORAGE HAS BEEN MOVED NORTH. IT IS STILL ON THE WEST PORTION OF THE SITE. ONE OF THE ADDITIONAL MEASURES THAT HAS BEEN ADDED IS CALLED A NOMO LANDSCAPING AREA ON THE SOUTH ENDST OF THE SITE. AND ALSO AS MR. HARDEN MENTIONED, ANOTHER IMPORTANT DESIGN COMPONENT WERE ADDED PROTECTIONS OFFERED BY THE PETITIONER TO INCREASE AGAINST STORMY DANIELSWATER BLEWTANTS... STORMWATER POLLUTANTS.

I HAVE RECEIVED AN EMAIL FROM OUR STORMWATER ADMINISTRATOR AND THE CITY'S ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT.

HE STATED THAT THE LOCATION OF THIS GAS STATION WOULD BE IN THE FIVE-YEAR TRAVEL BOUNDARY OF THE CITY'S WELL... WELLS IN THIS

[00:25:01]

THE PETITIONER WAS ASKED TO REFERENCE AND FOLLOW IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF THE PRECAUTIONARY MEASURES THAT THE 146TH AND RIVER ROAD GAS STATION TOOK WHEN IT WAS APPROVED BACK IN 2013.

THEY HAVE DONEEL IS OF THESE ITEMS. HOWEVER, NOT ALL OF THEM. ONE OF THEM THAT JOHN MENTIONED WAS REGARDING THE UNDER-CANOPY AREAS.

THIS IS A LITTLE BEYOND MY AREA. I'M GOING TO READ THIS FROM WHAT HE SAID. IT WAS CALLED... IT SAID "THE POSITIVE LIMITING BARRIER WHICH PROVIDES ADDED STORMWATER PROTECTION." THAT SYSTEM DRAINS THE FUELING AREAS UNDERNEATH THE CANOPY TO A DEAD-END 8,000-GALLON UNDERGROUND STORAGE TANK WITH GAS MONITORING WITHIN THE IMPERMEABLE LINER AREA. THIS IS A MORE PASSIVE SYSTEM THAT CONTAINS SURFACE LEAKS AND SPILLS.

THE TANK IS PUMPED OUT AS NECESSARY TO RESTORE STORAGE CAPACITY AS FUEL ACCUMULATES FROM SMALL FUELING SPILLS OR AFTER A LARGER SURFACE SPILL. WHAT I JUST DESCRIBED IS SOMETHING THAT THE 146TH AND RIVER ROAD GAS STATION DID WHICH IS MORE ROBUST THAN WHAT WAS MENTIONED HERE.

SO I THINK THIS IS ONE AREA THAT WE WILL KEEP WORKING WITH THE PETITIONER ON TO INCREASE PROTECTION MEASURES AGAINST SURFACE SPILLS AND LEAKAGE FROM THE UNDERGROUND STORAGE TANKS.

REGARDING THE BUILDING DESIGN, THE PETITIONER HAS BEEN IN CONTACT WITH ME TO PROVIDE THE UNKNOWN PUD STANDARDS SUCH AS THE PARCEL COVERAGE AND THE LANDSCAPING PERCENT.

THEY HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH ME ON ADJUSTMENTS TO THE FRONT ENTRY DESIGN AS REQUESTED. REGARDING THE PARKING, THE NEW PUD LANGUAGE TALKS ABOUT THE REQUIREMENT TO BE GENERALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE CONCEPT PLAN. THE PREVIOUS REQUIREMENT WAS PER THE UDO OR THE ZONING ORDINANCE WHICH WAS PRIOR TO THE UDO, AND THAT WOULD REQUIRE ABOUT A HUNDRED ADDITIONAL PARKING SPACES. THERE SIMPLY IS NOT ROOM FOR 100 ADDITIONAL PARKING SPACES. BUT THE PETITIONER IS SATISFIED WITH THE AMOUNT OF PARKING. AT 407 SPACES.

WHICH COULD CHANGE DEPENDING ON IF ANY ADDITIONAL SITE PLAN CHANGES OCCUR FROM THIS CONCEPT PLAN.

BUT WE ARE GENERALLY IN SUPPORT OF THE PLAN AS PROPOSED.

THE BUILDING SIZE AS PROPOSED, THE LAYOUT AS PROPOSED, AND IN SUPPORT OF THE PUD AMENDMENT. SO WE WOULD RECOMMEND THIS GOES TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE ON FEBRUARY 7, AND IF YOU PREFER TO GIVE COMMITTEE THE AUTHORITY TO MAKE THE RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL THAT, WOULD WORK FOR US AS WELL.

THANK YOU. >> OKAY.

THANK YOU. THAT CONCLUDES THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS DOCKET. QUESTIONS AND DISCUSSION FROM MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION? ADAM?

>> THANK YOU, MR. PRESIDENT. RACHEL, I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PLACEMENT OF THE GAS STATION.

SO IT SEEMS THERE ARE A FEW LIMITATIONS RIGHT NOW WITH...

YOU DON'T WANT IT TOO CLOSE TO COOL CREEK.

YOU ALSO... THEY HAVE THE 500-FOOT BUFFERS.

BETWEEN THAT AND NEIGHBORS WHICH THE COUNCIL HAD PASSED.

THEN THERE IS THE ACTUAL FLOW BETWEEN THE GAS STATION AND THE BUILDING ITSELF. SO JUST KIND OF EXPLAIN TO ME KIND OF WHERE YOU ARE AT WITH LOCATION.

IS IT, IS IT WHERE IF YOU MOVE IT ONE WAY, YOU RUN INTO ANOTHER PROBLEM? WHAT IS GOING ON THERE?

>> YES. ABSOLUTELY.

SO IF YOU MOVE IT TOO FAR NORTH, THEN YOU WILL RUN INTO PROBLEMS WITH THE FLOW OF THE GENERAL SITE FLOW OF PEOPLE AND PARKING AS THEY WOULD PREFER CLOSE TO THE ENTRY.

YOU ALSO RUN INTO CONCERNS ON REDUCING THE NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES BEYOND WHAT THEY WOULD BE COMFORTABLE WITH.

IN A PREVIOUS ITERATION, THE UNDERGROUND STORAGE TANKS WERE ALL THE WAY AT THE SOUTH END OF THE SITE.

THE CLOSEST THEY COULD BE TO THE CREEK.

AND SO BY MOVING THOSE FURTHER NORTH, AND MORE IN LINE WITH THE TANKS OR THE PUMPS, WE FELT COMFORTABLE AND CONFIDENT THAT THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR GREATER DISTANCE BETWEEN THE PUMPS AND THE TANKS BEFORE IT GOT TO THE SOUTH END OF THE SITE AND THE CREEK. EVENTUALLY.

SO IT IS A BALANCE OF ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU MENTIONED,

[00:30:02]

SO IT WAS A LOT OF BACK-AND-FORTH, AND WE EVEN WORKED ON THE CONCEPT PLAN HAVING PARKING SPACES ON THE WEST... THE VERY WEST PORTION OF THE SITE VERSUS HAVING THE CLEAR DRIVE AISLE ALL THE WAY DOWN. LOTS OF DIFFERENT CHANGES TO THE CONCEPT PLAN WERE MADE IN GETTING TO THIS FINAL VERSION.

>> YOU WORKED ALL THE OPTIONS. THIS WAS THE BEST OPTION THAT WE

COULD COME AT. >> YES.

>> WHAT IS THE DISTANCE BET BETWEEN... I NOPE IT EXCEEDS 500. WHAT IS THE DISTANCE RIGHT NOW BETWEEN THAT AND THE NEIGHBORHOOD?

>> I BELIEVE IT IS ABOUT 56-SOMETHING HANG ON ONE SECOND.

SO THE EDGE OF THE PUMPS ARE 558 FEET AWAY FROM DANBURY ESTATES AND 608 FEET AWAY FROM LAURA VISTA.

GREATER THAN THE MINIMUM 500 FEET.

>> ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU.

>> MR. DIERCKMAN? >> YEAH.

>> YOU COULD BRING SOME ELEVATIONS, WHAT IT WILL LOOK LIKE FROM KEYSTONE PARKWAY WHEN YOU ARE HEADING NORTH.

WE WILL BE GOING NORTH, WE WILL BE SEEING THE GAS STATION, THE BUILDINGS. WHAT THAT WILL LOOK LIKE.

WHAT KIND OF LANDSCAPING YOU WILL BE PROVIDING TO ENHANCE THAT VISION. THAT VIEW FROM KEYSTONE PARKWAY

NORTH HEADING NORTH. >> I JUST WANT TO REVIEW REAL QUICK. SOME OF THESE PUD STANDARDS THAT ARE NOT MET TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND THIS.

MAYBE YOU EXPLAINED THIS. THIS ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN REQUIREMENTS. GOLDEN SECTION.

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? >> SO I'M GOING NEED HELP FROM THEIR ARCHITECT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE BUILDING MEETS THIS, AND IT BASICALLY BREAKS DOWN THE BUILDING IN TERMS OF PROPORTIONALITY. I THINK IT IS, LIKE, HALF OF THE BUILDING COULD FIT INTO THE OTHER HALF.

IT WAS A STANDARD, A POPULAR STANDARD YEARS BACK WHEN THIS

PUD WAS WRITTEN. >> I HAVE NEVER HEARD THAT.

>> IT IS AN ARCHITECTURAL TERM. I DO NEED TO WORK WITH THEIR ARCHITECT ON COMPLIANCE WITH THAT AND/OR A POSSIBLE

ADJUSTMENT TO ■THATSECTION. >> OKAY SO.

WE DON'T REALLY HAVE A FOOTPRINT FOR THE SIZE OF THIS BUILDING YET. OR... IS THIS ALL COMPLETE? I'M LOOKING AT. THIS.

>> I THINK WHAT YOU SEE ON THE CONCEPT PLAN IS WHAT THEY ARE PROPOSING. IT IS ABOUT 100,000 SQUARE FEET.

>> OKAY. WE ARE CHANGING, BECAUSE I KNOW WITH THE LOWES, THEY WERE PRETTY STRICT FOR CHANGING... THE PROPANE TANKS CAN GO OUTSIDE. ANYTHING THEY PULL OUT, GOES

BACK IN. >> YES.

>> AND THEN DELIVERY TRUCKS WILL ALL BE IN THE BACK.

I'M TRYING TO THINK OF THE FLOW OF.

THIS IF WE THOUGHT OF EVERYTHING.

BETWEEN PARKING AND SIDEWALKS AND ACCESS.

AND ACCESS UP TO... YOU KNOW, OVER TO LOWES.

HAS THAT BEEN LAID OUT? >> IT HAS BEEN LAID OUT CONCEPTUALLY. IT IS NOT 100% NAILED DOWN.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THEY HAVE DONE, LIKE, THE TURNING RADIUS FOR THE FIRE TRUCK OR THINGS LIKE THAT.

BECAUSE RIGHT NOW THIS IS NOT THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN.

THIS IS JUST THEIR CONCEPT PLAN. AND SO WE REALLY WANTED TO DIVE INTO IT AS MUCH AS WE COULD TO MAKE SURE WE KNEW WHAT WE WERE GOING TO GET, IF WE APPROVED THESE CHANGES TO THE PUD.

>> THE PUD. THIS WILL COME BACK.

>> THIS WILL COME BACK TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION IF APPROVED BY CITY COUNCIL FOR A DEVELOPMENT PLAN AND ADLS

APPROVAL. >> YES.

OKAY. THEY WEREN'T ANSWERED HERE.

A LITTLE CONCERN. >> THIS WAS MORE GENERAL ABOUT THE CHANGES THEY WOULD NEED TO MAKE IN THE PUD TO LET THIS

HAPPEN. >> OKAY.

THANK YOU. >> YUP.

>> SO YOU KNOW, I SHARE THOSE CONCERNS ABOUT THE GAS STATION.

I THINK JUST TRYING TO MAKE SURE THERE IS NO RUNOFF INTO THE CREEK. I'M GLAD YOU ARE MEETING THAT

[00:35:02]

THAT IS A POSITIVE. I HAD A QUESTION AND THIS MIGHT BE FOR ONE OF THE TWO LAWYERS. I PULLED UP THE ORIGINAL 146TH STREET AND KEYSTONE PUD.

THIS WAS BACK FROM 2000. I'M LOOKING AT THE RIGHT ONE.

RIGHT? OKAY.

IT WAS APPROVED BY THE CITY COUNCIL, BUT IT WAS NOT APPROVED BY THE MAYOR. HAS IT BEEN AMENDED? IS IT... THERE IS A NOTE ON IT. AT LEAST ONE THAT IS IN OUR FILE THAT SAYS "MAYOR IS VETOING." I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE ARE WORKING FROM THE RIGHT... THAT WE ARE ALL WORKING FROM THE RIGHT ORDINANCE. THAT THIS IS THE CORRECT PUD.

>> MADAM VICE PRESIDENT, I'M NOT SURE.

I WILL HAVE TO LOOK INTO THAT SPECIFIC...

>> IS IT PERHAPS WE DIDN'T GET THE RIGHT ONE LOADED INTO OUR

LASER FEATURE? >> I WOULD BE VERY SURPRISED IF THE PUD WAS CREATED WITH A VETO. I'M SURE IT WAS RESOLVED SOMEHOW. I WILL CHECK.

>> OKAY. I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE ARE

LOOKING AT THE RIGHT PUD. >> ABSOLUTELY.

>> MIKE IS GOING TO SPEAK TO THAT.

>> THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES.

THAT IS THE CORRECT PUD. THE MAYOR CAN'T VETO A ZONING ORDINANCE. SO EVEN THOUGH HE VETOED IT, THE COUNCIL PASSED THE ORDINANCE, AND THAT IS THE OFFICIAL PUD.

>> OKAY. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU FOR CLARIFYING THAT. THAT IS SOMETHING I HAD NOT SEEN IN ONE OF OUR PUDS BEFORE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> IT WAS A CONTROVERSIAL PROJECT AT THE TIME.

>> OH. >> NOT EVERYBODY WAS HAPPY.

OBVIOUSLY, THE MAYOR WASN'T HAPPY.

I THINK WE HAVE ALL KIND OF COME TO...

THE LOWES PROJECT HAS GROWN ON US OVER THE YEARS.

AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO THE DISCUSSION ON THE B.J.'S

ADDITION. >> OKAY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR CLARIFYING THAT.

>> IS THIS SOMETHING THAT WE COULD JUST APPROVE AT THE COMMITTEE LEVEL AND MOVE IT ON TO CITY COUNCIL SINCE WE HAVE ADLS AMEND AND SO FORTH? COMING BACK TO US ANYWAY? BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE ALL THE HARD WORK...

>> IT COULD BE. BECAUSE THIS IS SIMPLY A

RECOMMENDATION. >> RIGHT, RIGHT.

>> SO OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE ALLOW US TO DELEGATE THOSE KINDS OF THINGS. ALL OF THESE ISSUES TO ANY OF THESE ISSUES, I SHOULD SAY, TO THE COMMITTEE, DEPENDING ON HOW WE DEALT... WHAT AUTHORITY WE DELEGATE TO THE COMMITTEE.

WE COULD GO TO COMMITTEE. GET A FAVORABLE RECOMMENDATION THERE AND THEN ADVANCE FROM THERE TO THE COUNCIL, IF WE TAKE

THE MOTION HERE TONIGHT. >> OKAY.

BECAUSE I MEAN, THE BIG THING WITHLOS WITH LOWES WAS WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE FROM THE ROADS AND WHAT DID THE TOP OF THE BUILDING

LOOK LIKE. >> SECOND STORY.

>> ABSOLUTELY. THIS WILL BE CRITICAL HERE AS WELL. WHAT THE BUILDING LOOKS LIKE

FROM THE STREET VIEWS. >> STEVE, WHAT IS... ON LOWES WAY TODAY, THERE IS PROPOSED TO BE A RIGHT TURN ONLY, A RIGHT OUT ONLY, IS THERE ONLY STRIPING DOWN THE MIDDLE OF LOWES WAY? I MEAN, WHAT IS OUR, WHAT IS OUR DEFENSE AGAINST SOMEBODY TRYING

TO TURN LEFT OUT OF THERE? >> THANK YOU, MR. PRESIDENT.

THE PLAN IS TO HAVE... THERE WOULD BE A MEDIAN ADDED OUT IN FRONT, IN LOWES WAY RIGHT IN FRONT OF THAT RIGHT-OUT ONLY.

IT IS NOT JUST THE RIGHT-OUT. THERE WOULD BE A MEDIAN INSTALLED OUT IN FRONT OF THAT AS WELL.

>> THANK YOU. I THINK THE REST OF MY QUESTIONS HAVE TO DO MORE WITH THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN ONCE THAT COMES BACK TO US. SO ADAM?

>> RACHEL, ARE THERE ANY CONCERNS ABOUT THE SINGLE POINT OF ENTRY FOR THOSE TRAVELING FROM THE SOUTHBOUND INTO EITHER

LOWES OR B.J.'S? >> WE DON'T HAVE ANY CONCERNS, BUT DO THINK THAT THE IMPROVEMENTS THAT THEY WOULD MAKE AS PART OF THE OVERALL A AREA, LIKE AT 146TH AND LOWES WAY WOULD BE VERY GOOD TO HAVE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT STEVE WAS MENTIONING IS THE ADDED SLIP LANE TO GO SOUTH OUT OF THE ROUNDABOUT FOR PEOPLE COPPING OUT. ... FOR PEOPLE COMING OUT.

THAT WASN'T THERE. IT WAS NEVER CONSTRUCTED BECAUSE THERE WAS NOT ALWAYS A WAY TO GO SOUTH.

LIKE, THAT WAS THE END. LIKE, YOU COULD COME NORTH OFF OF KEYSTONE AND GET OFF OF THERE TO GO TO 146TH STREET.

YOU COULD NEVER GO SOUTH. THAT WAS ONE OF THE PROJECTS THAT THE COUNTY DID RECENTLY SO YOU CAN NOW GO SOUTH AND GET BACK ON TO KEYSTONE. OR YOU CAN GO ALL THE WAIL OVER TO RANGELINE. THAT WAS IMPORTANT TO MENTION.

JUST REMEMBER THAT THE ROAD DIDN'T GO SOUTH.

BEFORE. WE DO BELIEVE THAT THE

[00:40:03]

BECAUSE ONCE YOU GET INTO THE SITE OUT THIS ROUNDABOUT, THERE IS PLENTY OF WAYS TO DISPERSE AND GO AROUND THE SITE.

>> OKAY. >> THERE ARE NO OTHER QUESTIONS OR SUGGESTIONS OF ISSUES TO BE CONSIDERED AT THE COMMITTEE LEVEL, THEN I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

>> I'LL TAKE A SHOT AT IT. I'LL MOVE TO MOVE THE DOCKET NUMBER PZ202200224 B.J.'S WHOLESALE CLUB, 146TH AND KEYSTONE PUD AMENDMENT TO THE COMMERCIAL HIT TEE AND GIVE THEM PAST TO FINAL APPROVAL TO MOVE FORWARD TO THE CITY COUNCIL.

>> I'LL SECOND. >> THANK YOU BOTH.

THEN JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, WHILE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT COMMITTEES, THE COMMITTEE ASSIGNMENTS FOR 2023, THIS WOULD GO TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE UNDER THIS MOTION IF IT PASSES.

THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE WOULD BE COMPRISED OF MEMBERS AASEN, DIERCKMAN, KIRSH, AND ZOCCOLA. WE HAVE A MOTION, DULY SECOND ON THE FLOOR. ALL IN FAVOR, SIGNIFY BY SAYING

AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT.

THIS WILL GO TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE.

AND FROM THERE, TO THE COUNCIL. >> AND BRAD, I WOULD ENCOURAGE ANY MEMBERS TO SEND US ANY COMMENTS THAT THEY HAVE IN REGARD TO THIS, THAT THEY WANT US TO PAY PARTICULAR ATTENTION

TO AT THIS LEVEL. >> AGREED.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU, STEVE.

OUR SECOND PUBLIC HEARING TONIGHT IS DOCKET PZ-2202237.

CARMEL MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING AT THE BRIDGES.

THE APPLICANT SEEKS SITE PLAN AND DESIGN APPROVAL FOR A NEW THREE-STORY MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING ON 9.32 ACRES.

ILLINOIS STREET AND PITTMAN WAY. SOUTH OF THE MARKET DISTRICT GROCERY AND WEST OF THE KAR OFFICE BUILDING.

THE FUTURE ADDRESS WILL BE 11380 ILL KNOW STREET.

THE ZONING IS PUD UNDER THE ORDINANCE THE BRIDGES.

THIS SITE IS NOT WITHIN ANY OVERLAY.

THE PETITION IS FILED BY NATHAN WINSLOW OF AMERICAN STRUCTUREPOINT ON BEHALF OF THE OWNER, CORNERSTONE COMPANIES.

MR. WINSLOW, THE FLOOR IS YOURS.

ONCE WE GET THE TECHNOLOGY TAKEN CARE OF.

>> ALL RIGHT. GOOD EVENING, MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION. FOR THE RECORDS, NATHAN WINSLOW WITH AMERICAN STRUCTURE POINT. OFFICE AT 9025 RIVER ROAD IN INDIANAPOLIS. I'M HERE TONIGHT WITH THE OWNER, AS YOU MENTIONED, OR THE DEVELOPER.

JEFF SHIVELY AND JIMMY CLARK. AMERICAN STRUCTURE POINT DID THE ARCHITECTURE SIDE. MOST OF THIS YOU PROBABLY ALREADY HAVE SEEN IN YOUR COMMISSION PACKETS, FOR THOSE MEMBERS IN THE AUDIENCE THAT MAY NOT HAVE SEEN THOSE, I'LL GAVE BRIEF INTRODUCTION HERE. THE SITE IS LOCATED JUST NORTH OF 111TH STREET AND ILLINOIS STREET.

AS YOU MENTIONED, ACROSS FROM THE KAR BUILDING.

MORE RECENTLY, ABOUT SIX MONTHS AGO, I BELIEVE, THE STEDMAN APARTMENTS PROJECT WAS APPROVED THROUGH HERE.

THAT WAS A PROJECT THAT OCCUPIES THE WEST HALF ESSENTIALLY OF THIS REMAINING DEVELOPMENT... DEVELOPABLE LAND.

HERE IS A COPY OF THE SITE PLAN FOR YOU.

AGAIN, THE BUILDING IS APPROXIMATELY 17,000 SQUARE FEET OF FOOTPRINT. IT WILL BE THREE-STORIES TALL.

EQUATING TO 54,000 TOTAL GROWTH SQUARE FEET OF USABLE SPACE.

WE HAVE PARKING. A LITTLE BIT MORE SPARKING THAN IS REQUIRED BY THE ORDINANCE. HOWEVER, WITH FUTURE DEVELOPMENTS, SOME PARKING IS INTENDED TO BE SHARED.

THE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT WILL COME THROUGH HERE AT AN UNKNOWN DATE.

IN THE NOT SO DISTANT FUTURE FOR THE SOUTH HALF.

ONE THING WE HAVE WORKED WITH STAFF ON IS COORDINATING AN INTERNAL ACCESS DRIVE ALLOWING FOR THE CONNECTION OF WHAT HAS BEEN APPROVED AND CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION.

AS THIS KIND OF SPINE ROADS IF COMMITTING PITTMAN WAY DOWN TO 11TH STREET WILL HAVE AN INTERNAL PASS-THROUGH CONNECTION ROAD THAT COMES AND SERVES OUR SITE.

AND THAT CURB CUT ON THE EVES SIDE CURRENTLY EXISTS.

IMMEDIATELY ACROSS FROM THE CAR FACILITY.

HERE IS AN ENLARGEMENT OF THE AREA.

ONE THING TO NOTE WITH THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT, WE ARE ONLY SEEKING THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN ADLS APPROVAL FOR THE PORTION OF

[00:45:03]

FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE DRIVEN BY THERE LATELY, THERE IS A SUBSTANTIAL SOIL STOCKPILE.

PRETTY MUCH WHERE THAT BUILDING IS LOCATED.

THAT WILL BE DISPERSED ACROSS THE SITE.

LOCATED MORE ON THE SOUTH. WE WILL HAVE A TEMPORARY DRY BASIN AT THE SOUTH END. TO MEET THE RUNOFF REQUIREMENTS AS THIS PROJECT MOVES FORWARD. HERE IS AN OVERLAY OF THE OVERALL SITE WITH AN AERIAL. AS YOU CAN SEE, THE EXISTING KIDNEY BEAN POND THAT EXISTS OUT THERE TODAY, THAT IS BEING RECONSTRUCTED AS PART OF THE STEDMAN PROJECT.

THAT POND WILL BE ENTIRELY LOCATED WEST OF THIS SPINE ROAD.

WHAT YOU SEE INFRINGING ON THIS PARTICULAR PARCEL WILL BE NO LONGER. IF AND WHEN THIS PROJECT PROCEEDS FORWARD. HOPEFULLY, VERY SOON.

AGAIN, AN ENLARGEMENT OF THAT AREA.

LANDSCAPE-WISE, WE HAVE TAKEN SOME PRETTY GOOD LENGTHS TO NOT ONLY MEET BUT EXCEED SOME MINIMUM LANDSCAPE REQUIREMENTS.

THERE IS A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF PERIMETER LANDSCAPING.

ALL UTILITIES WILL BE... TRASH ENCLOSURES, UTILITY EQUIPMENT THAT IS OUTSIDE WILL BE SCREENED WITH LANDSCAPING AND SCREEN WALLS, AS NECESSARY. WE ARE WORKING WITH STAFF AND ENGINEERING TO KIND OF DEVELOP THIS MAIN ENTRY FOCAL POINT.

AS YOU COME INTO THIS DEVELOPMENT.

TRYING TO KEEP WITH THE SPIRIT OF THE BRIDGES.

MAKE SOMETHING APPEALING AND VISUALLY APPETIZING.

I HAVE A COUPLE OF ELEVATIONS HERE TO SHARE WITH YOU.

MOST OF THIS BUILDING IS CONSTRUCTED USING BRICK.

WE HAVE BRICK, LIMESTONE, METAL PANELS, AND GLASS.

I THINK IT IS PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY, WHICH PARTS ARE THE LIMESTONE AND BRICK ON HERE.

THERE WILL BE SOME ROOFTOP MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT.

THAT WILL BE SCREENED BY METAL PANELING, AS YOU CAN SEE.

ALSO KEEPING WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE PUD, THE BRIDGES PUD USING A PRAIRIE-STYLE ARCHITECTURE.

DECAN SPEAK TO THE A ARCHITECTUL INFLUENCES IF THERE ARE QUESTIONS DOWN THE ROAD. THERE IS SOME MATERIAL REFERENCES. THE BRICK, THE STONE VENEER, ACCENTS. BUILDING SIGNAGE.

I KNOW THAT WAS ONE NOTE ON RACHEL'S REPORT.

WORKING THROUGH THAT WITH STAFF TO TRY TO COME TO AN AGREEMENT ON THE SIGNAGE. TRY TO KEEP IT CLASSY WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE BUILDING. WE ARE LOOKING AT THREE TENANTS ON THIS BUILDING. THAT EQUATES TO A DECENT NUMBER OF SIGNS. MOVING FORWARD, IN A COUPLE OF RENDERINGS, AND ELEVATIONS OF THIS BUILDING, THIS WOULD BE FROM THE CORNER OF PITTMAN WAY AND ILLINOIS STREET.

LOOKING KIND OF TOWARDS THE SOUTHWEST.

THIS IS THAT ENHANCED KIND OF LANDSCAPE ENTRY FOCAL POINT.

AGAIN, WORKING WITH ENGINEERING AND STAFF TO COME TO A GOOD WAY TO ENHANCE THIS CORNER. ENGINEERING HAS EXPRESSED SOME CONCERN ABOUT THE WATER FEATURES THIS CLOSE TO A ROADWAY.

WE HAVE A LIMITED AMOUNT OF SPACE.

WE ARE WORKING WITH THEM TO TRY TO COME TO AN AGREEMENT ON A SAFE YET APPEALING CORNER OF THE BUILDING HERE.

AGAIN, WE ARE LOOKING AT THE BUILDING.

THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE BUILDING.

THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE BUILDING WHERE THE PARKING LOT WOULD BE.

YOU KIND OF SEE THE MAIN ATRIUM AREA IN THE MIDDLE.

LIGHTING PLAN IS PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY.

I HOPE YOU GUYS CAN READ THOSE NUMBERS.

I CAN'T. THIS IS JUST A QUICK SNIPPET OF THE LIGHT FIXTURE, WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

THERE IS ONE QUESTION, A COMMENT ABOUT MAKING SURE THE LIGHTING FOR THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT MATCHES THE LIGHTING OF THE STEDMAN APARTMENTS. WE CURRENTLY HAVE A DIFFERENT BRAND. THE GENERAL SPECS ARE THE SAME.

THE OTHER COMMENT WAS ABOUT REDUCING THE LIGHT POLE HEIGHT FROM 25 FEET TO 20 FEET. I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYBODY HAS AN OBJECTION FROM THE TEAM ON THAT PARTICULAR ISSUE.

THERE WAS ANOTHER QUESTION THAT WE RECEIVED FROM THE PUBLIC RELATED TO LIGHTING EFFICIENCIES, EFFECTIVELY.

THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT WILL UTILIZE PHOTO CELLS TO TURN THE LIGHTS ON. AS THE LIGHT LEVELS DECREASE IN THE EVENING. AS DUSK STARTS TO ARISE.

THEY WILL BE SET ON TIMERS TO KICK OFF AFTER NORMAL BUSINESS WORK HOURS. SO WE ARE NOT CREATING MASSIVE

[00:50:01]

IT IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A 24-7 OPERATION.

THOSE LIGHTS WILL BE TURNED OFF OTHER THAN JUST THE EMERGENCY LIGHTING THAT IS NEEDED AFTER DARK.

SO WE WILL BE REPRESENTATIVE OF THAT.

I BELIEVE THAT IS THE EXTENT OF THE QUESTIONS THAT WE REALLY RECEIVED. AGAIN, THERE WAS A COMMENT ABOUT THE MAINTENANCE OF THESE PONDS. I THINK THAT IS AN ISSUE.

OR THIS POND. THAT IS AN ISSUE THAT WE WILL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH ENGINEERING STAFF ON TO MAKE SURE THAT NUMBER ONE, WE CAN BUILD IT HOW WE WANT IT.

AND HOW BEST TO MAINTAIN THAT. I BELIEVE THAT IS IT.

IF ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS, I'LL TURN IT BACK TO YOU GUYS.

>> THANK YOU. THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING.

CAN I SEE A SHOW OF HANDS FOR THOSE WHO WISH TO SPEAK ON THIS PETITION? ONE, TWO, THREE.

ALL RIGHT. WE WILL GIVE YOU FIVE MINUTES...

UP TO FIVE MINUTES EACH. AND IF ONE OF YOU WOULD APP APPROACH, AND NUMBER TWO, WAIT BEHIND THE FIRST SPEAKER,

PLEASE. >> OKAY.

MY NAME IS RON. I LIVE AT SPRING MILL PLACE SUBDIVISION. I'M THE PRESIDENT OF THE H.O.A.

ASSOCIATION. I THINK AT LEAST IN PART, MY CONCERN WAS ADDRESSED BY THE SPEAKER.

AND THAT WAS THE OBJECTIVE 1.6.17 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

CALLING FOR RESPONSIBLE USE OF EMERGENCY THROUGH CONSERVATION OF ELECTRICITY AND THE NIGHTTIME LIGHTING OF NONRESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS AFTER NORMAL BUSINESS HOURS.

I'M NOT SURE I HEARD A COMPLETE ANSWER TO MY CONCERN.

THAT WAS MAINLY ADDRESSING THE PARKING LIGHTS.

BUT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE INTERNAL BUSINESS, THE LIGHTING OF THE INTERNAL BUILDING ITSELF. AFTER NORMAL BUSINESS HOURS.

IF YOU DRIVE THROUGH THE AREA, YOU CAN SEE EXAMPLES OF NIGHTTIME LIGHTING POLLUTION. PRIMARILY, THE ZOTEK BUILDING.

AS AN EXAMPLE OF, I THINK, WHY THIS OBJECTIVE WAS INSERTED INTO THE PLAN. SO JUST I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR ABOUT THE AFTER-HOURS, BUSINESS HOURS LIGHTING OF THE BUILDING ITSELF IS. INTERNALLY.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU.

>> BEFORE I START, CAN YOU EXPLAIN TO ME HOW I SHOW PICTURES? SOMEBODY...

OKAY. >> IF YOU WOULD LIKE ON THE...

IF YOU WOULD LOOK ON THE DESKTOP, JILL, THERE IS A TAPED OUTLINE. IF YOU LAY YOUR PAPERWORK WITHIN THAT RIGHT THERE. THERE YOU GO.

PERFECT. >> OKAY, GOOD.

OKAY. MY NAME IS JILL.

I LIVE AT WILLIAMS MILL, WEST OF THE BRIDGES.

THE PROPOSED CARMEL MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING IS NORTHEAST OF THE APPROVED STEDMAN APARTMENTS. IT IS NORTH OF THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AT SPRING MILL PLACE. AND EAST OF SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. MOST NEARBY NEIGHBORS I HAVE TALKED TO ACTUALLY ARE PLEASED WITH THIS PROPOSAL FOR THE NEW THREE-STORY CARMEL MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING.

AT THE BRIDGES. AND THEY THINK IT WOULD BE A GOOD USE. WE HAVE TWO CONCERNS THAT WERE BROUGHT UP BY THE PETITIONER. ACTUALLY.

ONE IS NIGHTLIGHTING. I AGREE WITH WHAT RON SAID.

YOU KNOW, I WANT TO GO OVER THAT AGAIN.

AND NEXT, I'M GLAD TO HEAR THAT THE LIGHT POLES WOULD BE LOWERED FROM 25 TO 20 FEET. AS THEY ARE AT STEDMAN.

THE THIRD THING I WOULD LIKE THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO THINK ABOUT IS THERE IS ALREADY A LOT OF LIGHT POLLUTION IN THE AREA OF THE BRIDGES. AND STEDMAN WILL BE SORT OF IN THE MIDST OF THIS, AND HOW WOULD THESE LIGHTS AFFECT STEDMAN? I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU LOOK AT. THAT THAT IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK... THE STEDMAN APARTMENTS. THAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED.

AND THIS PICTURE IS OF THE ENTRY FEATURE POND ELEMENT, AND IT LOOKS VERY NICE. AND CERTAINLY, PEOPLE IN THE BRIDGES WOULD BE HAPPY TO SEE A BRIDGE THERE.

AND WATER. BUT WE HAVE CONCERNS BECAUSE THE FRONT OF THE BRIDGES HAS HAD TERRIBLE PROBLEMS WITH MAINTENANCE. IN TERMS OF THAT WATER.

AND SO YOU KNOW, IN THE BEGINNING, WE WERE TOLD IT WOULD

[00:55:05]

AND SO ON. WHAT WE HAVE GOTTEN IS TWO SEGMENTS ALONG THE STREET THAT HAVE NOT BEEN AN INVITING ENTRY INTO THE BRIDGES. THE FIRST ONE IS A NORTH OF CVS.

THIS WAS IN 2017. AND THE SECOND ONE WAS IN FRONT OF JIMMY JOHN'S. THAT WAS IN 2017 ALSO.

BUT EVEN YESTERDAY, I DECIDED I WOULD LOOK AGAIN.

AND THIS WAS WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE YESTERDAY.

AND THE FRONT, THIS IS NORTH OF CVS.

BOTH OF THOSE. AND THIS IS IN FRONT OF MATH-NASIUM. IT IS REALLY DISTURBING.

EVERYBODY THAT DRIVES IN THERE SEES THE PARKING AT CVS OR OTHER PLACES. WE HAVE TALKED TO THE MAINTENANCE PERSON AT THE BRIDGES.

I KNOW THIS ISN'T THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE PETITIONER. BUT NOTHING HAS REALLY CHANGED OVER A PERIOD OF TIME. WE KEEP BEING TOLD THAT THE PUMP WAS BROKEN, AND WE FEEL THAT WE DON'T WANT THIS TO BECOME ALSO AN EYESORE AND A HEALTH MENACE. BECAUSE THE WATER IS REALLY DISGUSTING. IT IS FILLED WITH ALGAE.

IT LOOKED LIKE STAGNANT TRASHY EYESORE.

NOT APPEALING. NOT THE WAY THAT CARMEL WANTS TO LOOK. IN FACT, SOME NEIGHBORS HAVE SUGGESTED THE WATER FEATURE BE FILLED IN WITH DIRT AND PLANTS IN THE FRONT. AND SO WHAT I DID WANT TO POINT OUT WAS THAT THE SAME DAY WHICH, WAS YESTERDAY, I WENT TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD POND, WONDERING IF OURS LOOKED THE SAME WAY.

IT DOESN'T. IT IS VERY CLEAR.

EXCEPT AT THE EDGES. THERE WERE NO CLEAR SPOTS IN FRONT OF THE BRIDGES AT ALL. SO I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW HOW THE WATER FEATURE AT THE MEDICAL OFFICE BIDDING WILL BE MAINTAINED. SO IT CAN BE AESTHETICALLY PLEASING. AND A COMMITMENT, I THINK, SHOULD BE ADDED ABOUT MAINTENANCE OF THE WATER FEATURE AND CONSEQUENCES IF THERE ARE PROBLEMS. WHEN I HAVE ASKED THE CITY, I HAVE TOLD... I AM TOLD THAT CODE ENFORCEMENT DOESN'T REALLY HAVE ANYTHING TO DO ABOUT.

THIS WHEN I CALLED ENGINEERING, I DIDN'T GET ANY CALLS BACK.

I'M NOT SURE WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR TRYING TO KEEP THE WATER ATTRACTIVE IN THESE FEATURES. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. >> GOOD EVENING.

MY NAME IS DON WORSHAM. THANK YOU FOR GIVING ME A MOMENT TO SPEAK WITH YOU. I LIVE AT SPRING MILL LANE.

I JUST DISCOVERED, THANKS TO MR WINSLOW'S PRESENTATION, THAT THE DOCUMENTATION ON-LINE EXCLUDED THE FACT THAT THE PROPERTY EXTENDED ALL THE WAY DOWN TO 11TH STREET.

THAT PUTS THAT PROPERTY 100 FEET FROM MY PROPERTY.

I HAVE CONCERNS THAT WITH THE APARTMENTS, 267 UNITS, GIVE OR TAKE, THIS DEVELOPMENT AND THE UNSPECIFIED DEVELOPMENT THAT WILL OCCUR TO THE SOUTH PORTION WHICH I'M HOPING EITHER MR. SHIVELY OR MR. CLARK WHO I UNDERSTAND OWNED THE PROPERTY MIGHT BE ABLE TO ADDRESS, AND THE OPENED AREA BETWEEN ILLINOIS AND THE OTHER STREET WHICH IS CURRENTLY UNDEVELOPED.

I HOPE THAT THERE IS A CONCERN THAT TRAFFIC TO THIS AREA IS GOING TO BECOME LIKE A BUILDING BLOCK THAT BECOMES UNMANAGEABLE.

NOW, I HAVE SEEN TRAFFIC AT 116TH AND SPRING MILL AND 11 6/TH THERE AT U.S. 31 WITH THE LINKED ROUNDABOUTS.

AS VIRTUALFY LIST A STANDSTILL. IT BECOMES ALMOST GRIDLOCKED.

NOW WE HAVE MEDICAL WITH TRAFFIC, AND WE DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH TRAFFIC IT WILL BE. THERE IS NO TRAFFIC STUDY.

THERE WAS A TRAFFIC STUDY DONE FOR THE APARTMENTS.

AND I BELIEVE THAT IT WOULD BE IN THE BEST INTEREST OF OUR COMMUNITY AT THIS AREA THAT WE TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN WHEN ALL THESE THINGS GET BILLED OUT.

I DON'T BELIEVE THE SPITE OF THE BENEFIT THAT A MEDICAL BUILDING WILL HAVE THERE, THAT IT BECOMES PART OF THE DOMINO EFFECT OF ALL OF THAT BUILDING, ALL THE MEDICAL, ALL THE TRAFFIC THAT HAPPENS WITH YOUR... I THINK IT IS A GOOD PLAN.

HAVING THE MEDICAL, AND THE... WHAT AM I TRYING TO SAY? I GUESS THE HOSPITALITY DISTRICT.

IT IS A LOT OF TRAFFIC TO GO THROUGH THERE.

NOW, IS THIS UNIT, THIS PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT GOING TO MEAN ANYTHING? I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING HAPPEN ON THE SOUTHERN HALF OF THE PROPERTY.

THE OWNERS MUST HAVE A PLAN. THEY BOUGHT IT.

AND I AM ASSUMING THAT THE PITTMANS NO LONGER HAVE AN INTEREST IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF. THAT DOES ANYONE KNOW? DO WE KNOW IF THE ORIGINAL PROPERTY OWNER STILL HAS ANY CONTROL OVER THE SOUTHERN PORTION OF THE AREA THAT IS

[01:00:03]

>> YOUR COMMENTS ARE WELCOME. YOU ARE SPEAKING TO THE

COMMISSION. >> WELL, I KNOW.

THE QUESTION IS THE DOES COMMISSION HAVE AN ANSWER TO

THAT QUESTION? >> THE PETITIONER WILL HAVE A CHANCE TO RESPOND AT THE END OF THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD.

>> OKAY. NOW, BOY, I HAD... I HAVE SO MANY CONCERNS OVER THE DIRECTION THIS IS GOING, BUT I'M MAINLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE FACT THAT THERE IS UNDEVELOPED SPACE HERE, AND AS A RESIDENT, THE CLOSEST RESIDENT TO THIS, I DON'T WANT TO SEE MY QUALITY OF LIFE AND MY COMMUNITY SACRIFICED BY SIMPLY IGNORING THE CONSEQUENCES OF A BUILDING BLOCK THAT EACH BLOCK LOOKS GOOD UNTIL YOU LOOK AT ALL THE BLOCKS TOGETHER.

THAT, I THINK, IS GOING TO BE PART OF YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO KEEP AN EYE ON THIS KIND OF BUILDING BLOCK, TIME AFTER TIME DEGRADATION, EACH STEP DOESN'T SEEM TO BE THAT BAD.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE WHOLE PICTURE, IT IS, LIKE, HOLY SMOKES. WHAT IS GOING ON HERE? WE HAVE BEEN IN THE SPRING MILL LANE DEVELOPMENTS IF... THE DEVELOPMENT HAS BEEN THERE FOR A LONG TIME.

THE WHOLE AREA WAS DIFFERENT THEN.

I THINK EVERYBODY IS TOLERATING THE DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE IT HAS BEEN DONE WIDELY... WISELY AND CAREFULLY.

I HOPE THAT WISDOM AND CALCULATION IS CONTINUED.

LET'S DON'T, LET'S DON'T RUN THIS THING INTO AN OUT-OF-CONTROL TRAFFIC, OUT-OF-CONTROL DENSITY, OUT-OF-CONTROL TO THE IMPACT OF THE QUALITY OF THE COMMUNITY.

AND I KNOW MR. WINSLOW HAS MY ADDRESS.

IT IS OKAY. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS GO TO THE CORNER OF SPRING MILL LANE. AND 11TH.

AND I'M ON THE SOUTHEAST CORNER. >> THANK YOU.

FOR YOUR TIME. I WILL BE LISTENING FOR YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT THE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT IN THAT AREA AT THE

END OF THIS. >> THANK YOU.

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK ON THIS PETITION? GREAT. THEN MR. WINSLOW, YOU HAVE UP TO FIVE MINUTES TO RESPOND TO ANY OF THE PUBLIC COMMENTS, IF

YOU WISH. >> THANK YOU.

I'LL LET JEFF SPEAK TO A FEW OF THESE HERE.

I WILL POINT OUT WE HAD A BRIEF DISCUSSION... ONE OF THE EARLIEST QUESTIONS IS ABOUT THE INTERNAL BUILDING LIGHTING.

THE NORMAL OPERATING HOURS WOULD BE FROM 7:00 TO 6:00 P.M.

SO I WOULD SPECULTE MAYBE AN HOUR BEFORE AND AN HOUR AFTER IS PROBABLY A REALISTIC TIME FRAME. I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE IS A MECHANISM THAT YOU CAN CONTROL. THAT WOULD BE THE EXPECTED MAIN OPERATING HOURS OF THE FACILITY. TO THE POINT ABOUT THE MAINTENANCE OF THE EXISTING PONDS THAT ARE OUT THERE, WE ARE SEEKING APPROVAL FOR THE SOUTH PORTION.

JUST THIS LITTLE PIECE OF THE BIG PUZZLE OF THE BRIDGES.

UNFORTUNATELY, WHAT IS UP ON 116TH, WHILE I APPRECIATE THE COMMENTS, UNFORTUNATELY, THAT IS A LITTLE BIT OUT OF OUR ABILITY TO ADDRESS AS PART OF THIS HEARING.

AND THIS DEVELOPMENT. IF YOU BUT WILL...

IF YOU WILL. THOSE REGARDS CAN CERTAINLY BE EXPRESSED TO THE OWNERS OF THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT, THOUGH.

I GUESS ONE THING TO COMMENT ON, THE POND THAT WE ARE SHOWING WITHIN OUR SPECIFIC PROPERTY. THAT PARTICULAR POND, DIFFERENT FROM WHAT YOU ARE SEEING ON 116TH.

WE WILL NOT HAVE ANY... THAT POND IS NOT INTENDED TO SERVE AS A DETENTION RESPOND FOR OUR SITE.

WE WILL HAVE UNDERGROUND DETENTION FOR OUR SITE.

THE SURFACE RUNOFF THAT YOU TYPICALLY GET WHICH IS WHAT THOSE LINEAR DRAINS, IF YOU WILL, ALONG 116TH ARE SERVING. THIS POND WILL NOT SERVE THAT SAME FUNCTION. THIS POND WILL RECEIVE SOME SURFACE RUN YAWCH. IT IS ONLY GOING TO BE WHAT'S COMING RIGHT TO IT. WE ARE TREATING ALL THE WATER THROUGH UNDERGROUND DETENTION, PROVIDING THAT ELSEWHERE.

I WOULD EXPECT BY DEFAULT, WHAT WITH THE PROPER CARE, THIS POND WILL NOT BE US IS SETTABLE TO THE SEDIMENT RUNOFF THAT YOU WERE SEEING. MAKING IT SO BROWN AND MURKY.

LY TURN IT OVER TO YOU, JEFF, IF YOU WANT TO SPEAK TO THE

COMMENTS. >> JEFF SHIVELY, EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT OF CORNERSTONE COMPANIES.

NORTH MERIDIAN STREET, INDIANAPOLIS.

REGARDING THE COMMENTS ABOUT THE REST OF THE DEVELOPMENT, WE WILL WORK WITH THE CITY OF CARMEL, THE PLAN COMMISSION AND RACHEL ON THE FURTHER DEVELOPMENT OF THOSE SITES.

THE USES AND THE LAYOUT ARE NOT DEFINED YET.

[01:05:04]

SO... >> THANK YOU.

WE WILL CONTINUE WITH THE DEPARTMENT REPORT.

>> THANK YOU. AGAIN, FOR THE RECORD, I'M THE PLANNER WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES.

AS WE HAVE HEARD TONIGHT, PETITIONER IS PROPOSING A NEW THREE-STORY OFFICE BUILDING. THIS PARCEL IS SLATED FOR BUSINESS USES. IT IS PART OF THE RESIDENTIAL AND OFFICE USE BLOCK OF THE BRIDGES PUD.

MANY OF THE PUD STANDARDS ARE MET BY THIS PROJECT.

AND THERE WERE ONLY A FEW UNKNOWN ITEMS AS MENTIONED IN THE DEPARTMENT REPORT. THOSE WERE RELATED TO THE LONG-TERM BICYCLE PARKING, AND THE SHOWER AND CHANGING FACILITIES AS WELL AS THE DUMPSTER ENCLOSURE DESIGN.

THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE DOES EXCEED THE ALLOWABLE NUMBER OF SIGNS PER FACADE. HOWEVER, THE TOTAL NUMBERS...

NUMBER OF SIGNS ALLOWED IS NOT EXCEEDED.

A VARIANCE WILL BE NEEDED. IT IS ONE THAT THE DEPARTMENT CAN SUPPORT, AS THE SIGNS ARE WELL-BALANCED AND DESIGNED SPECIFICALLY FOR PLACEMENT ON THE FACADE, AS SHOWN.

AS WE HAVE HEARD, THE NEIGHBORS HAVE SENT IN LETTERS CONCERNED ABOUT THE NIGHTTIME LIGHTING. OF THE BUILDING.

AND PARKING AREA AS WELL AS THE PROPOSED POND ENTRY FEATURE.

THE BRIDGES DEVELOPMENT HAS NOT HAD A LOT OF LUCK WITH THEIR PONDS ON 116TH STREET. WE DO FEEL THAT IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN. AND WE WILL WANT TO CONTINUE TO WORK ON THIS POND THAT ISN'T A DETENTION POND WITH THE PETITIONER AND WITH THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT.

IT IS AN AMENITY AND NOT A NUISANCE.

THE BIDDING DESIGN HAS UNDERGONE MANY CHANGES SINCE THEY FIRST APPLIED. WE ARE VERY PLEASED WITH THE PROGRESS AND THE LOOK OF THE BUILDING.

IT TAKES MANY OF ITS DESIGN QUEUES STRAIGHT FROM THE CON CONCEPT. IT FITS THE PRAIRIE ARCHITECTURAL STYLE WHICH IS REQUIRED BY THE PU.

AS MENTIONED, THIS BUILDING IS THE FIRST OF A FEW THAT WILL PROBABLY BE ON THIS HALF OF THE USE BLOCK.

WE ARE MAKING SURE THAT PEDESTRIAN CONNECTIVITY, VEHICULAR CONNECTIVITY AS WELL... IS WELL-DEAF SIGNED THROUGHOUT THE AREA AND... WELL-DESIGNED THROUGHOUT THE AREA. WE WILL BE PAYING CLOSE ATTENTION TO THAT AS MORE PROJECTS COME THROUGH FOR THEY S OFFICE AND RESIDENTIAL USE BLOCK OF THE PUD.

WE RECOMMEND THIS ITEM BE SENT TO THE FEBRUARY 7 COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE MEETING WITH THE COMMITTEE HAVING FINAL VOTING AUTHORITY. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. THAT CONCLUDES THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS DOCKET. QUESTIONS, DISCUSSION FROM THE COMMISSION? MR. DIERCKMAN?

>> I HAVE A LOT OF NOTES HERE FOR OUR COMMITTEE M MEETING.

LOOKING FORWARD TO HEARING MORE FROM THE OTHER PLAN COMMISSION MEMBERS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT I DON'T THINK I HAVE EVER HEARD ANYBODY SAY THAT THEY JUST DON'T HAVE ANY... I UNDERSTAND YOU DON'T HAVE ANY RESPONSIBILITY.

SOMETIMES, WHEN YOU ARE ASKING US FOR OUR HELP, WE ARE LOOKING TO YOU A LITTLE BIT FOR YOUR HELP, AND OUR PUBLIC HAS AN ISSUE WITH THESE OTHER PONDS. IT IS GOING TO BE DETRIMENTAL TO YOUR DESIRES FOR YOUR SITE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT CONNECTIVITY THERE IS TO THE CURRENT OWNER OF THOSE PONDS, TO YOUR PROPERTY AND SO FORTH AND SO ON. I CAN ASSURE YOU WE ARE GOING TO DO SOME DUE DILIGENCE HERE. WE ARE GOING TO FIND OUT WHAT THE CONNECTIVITY IS. AND IF THERE IS NOT, THEN WE WILL FIND SOMETHING ELSE. BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE BCA. YOU HAVE ALL KINDS OF THINGS THAT YOU HAVE TO DO HERE. WE NEED SOME COOPERATION.

I HAVE SEEN THOSE. THOSE THINGS ARE DESPICABLE.

THEY ARE DISGUSTING. IT IS REALLY DISHEARTENING BECAUSE THAT WAS WHAT WAS SOLD TO US IN THE PLANNING COMMISSION. YOU REMEMBER BACK IN THE DAY WHEN WE APPROVED THAT. AND IT IS A SAD REPRESENTATION OF OUR ABILITY TO ENFORCE PEOPLE TO MAINTAIN THEIR PROPERTIES.

SO IT MAY NOT BE YOUR PROBLEM RIGHT NOW, BUT PROBABLY WHEN YOU GET TO COMMITTEE, IT IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE YOUR PROBLEM.

>> SUE? >> I JUST WANT THE COMMITTEE ALSO TO THINK ABOUT THE APARTMENTS THAT ARE GOING IN AND THE FACT THAT THIS SCREENING ON THE TOP OF THIS BUILDING AND HOW IT IS VIEWED FROM THE APARTMENTS.

BECAUSE I BELIEVE THOSE ARE FIVE STORIES OVER THERE.

AND JUST NOT TO OVERLOOK BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T BEEN BUILT, HOW THIS COULD AFFECT THEM. THANK YOU.

>> CHRISTINE? >> SO AS FAR AS THE MEDICAL

[01:10:01]

BUT YOU KNOW, I HEAR EVERYBODY'S COMMENT ABOUT THE OTHER PONDS.

WHEN WE HAD THE BANK COME THROUGH HERE AT THAT TIME, WE WERE ABLE TO HAVE THE DEVE DEVELOPER... WHOEVER OWNS IT, TO FIX ALL THAT... ALL THOSE PAVERS.

REMEMBER HOW THEY WERE TORN UP? THEY DID COME UP AND FIX IT.

I'M NOT SURE IF IT IS WORTH. IF SOMEBODY CAN LOOK INTO THE PONDS AS WELL. ANYWAY, I LOOK FORWARD TO TALKING MORE AT COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE.

>> ADAM? >> THANK YOU, MR. PRESIDENT.

RACHEL, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN HELP US.

THIS MIGHT BE ME BEING NEW AND NOT BEING HERE WHEN THE APARTMENTS CAME. I WOULD LOVE TO SEE SOME SORT OF MAP KIND OF SEEING THE FOOTPRINT OF BOTH PROJECTS.

KIND OF TOGETHER. SO I CAN SEE HOW IT ALL KIND OF FITS TOGETHER. AND THEN FURTHERMORE, I KNOW THERE IS MORE PARKING HERE THAN IS REQUIRED.

THAT IS BECAUSE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT... WE MAY BE KIND OF GETTING AHEAD OF OURSELVES THERE.

IF WE HAVE ANY THOUGHT OF WHERE THAT WILL BE POSITIONED, TOO, SO WE CAN KIND OF GET A SENSE. BECAUSE I KNOW... YOU SAID MORE DEVELOPMENT IS COMING. AND PARKING IS NOT CHEAP.

NO ONE IS GOING TO BUILD MORE PARKING UNLESS THERE IS A HIGH

LIKELIHOOD THAT IT IS COMING. >> SO A COUPLE OF ANSWERS TO YOUR QUESTIONS. I IN THE PETITIONER'S PACT,S IF IT IS AN AERIAL VIEW OVER BOTH THE STEDMAN SIDE AND THIS SIDE.

AND IT SHOULD HAVE A BLACK OUTLINE OF WHAT THEY HAVE PROPOSED. WHAT THE STEDMAN HAS PROPOSED,

AND THEN WHAT THIS HAS PROPOSED. >> THAT IS APPENDIX B.

>> APPENDIX B? THAT SHOULD BE IN THE PACT.

WE CAN HAVE THEM DO SOMETHING MAYBE MORE BRIGHTER.

THICKER LINE WEIGHTS OR SOMETHING.

SO YOU CAN SEE IT BETTER. I COULD ALSO INCLUDE SOME OF THE COLORED SITE PLANS THAT THE STEDMAN HAD WHEN THEY WERE APPROVED. I CAN HELP WITH THAT.

AND THEN REGARDING FUTURE BUILDINGS ON THE SOUTH HALF OF THIS SITE, WE WOULD ENCOURAGE THEM TO ALL BE PLACED ADJACENT TO ILLINOIS STREET. AND I HONESTLY DON'T THINK THISE IS ROOM FOR MANY MORE THAN MAYBE ONE BUILDING.

MAYBE TWO. IF THEY ARE SMALL.

THERE ARE HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS FOR BUILDINGS PLACED ADJACENT TO 11TH STREET. ... 111TH STREET.

TWO-STORY MAXIMUM. THE FACT THAT THIS IS A THREE-STORY, WE MIGHT SEE A TWO-STORY.

WE HAVE MIGHT SEE A ONE-STORY. WE ARE NOT GOING TO SEE ANYTHING LARGE OR LARGER THAN WHAT IS HERE WITH THIS ONE.

BECAUSE THERE ISN'T ROOM FOR IT. THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO PARK

IT. >> RACHEL, THE SHEET...

I THINK IT IS L-102 IS NOT PART OF THIS PACKAGE.

BUT L-101, SORT OF THE BROAD STROKE LANDSCAPE PLAN, BUT L-102 WOULD BE THE PLAN ACTUALLY WITHIN THE POND.

THE WATER FEATURE AREA. IF THAT IS PART OF THE LANDSCAPE PLAN, THEN DOES THAT BRING AN ENFORCEMENT OPPORTUNITY TO THE DEPARTMENT BECAUSE NOW WE HAVE LANDSCAPING THAT IS INTEGRAL TO THE PONDS? WHERE THAT DOESN'T EXIST ALONG

116TH STREET. >> YES.

ABSOLUTELY. AND I DO BELIEVE THAT THROUGH WORKING WITH ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT, THEY SHOULD HAVE T TO... THERE IS A REGULAR MAINTENANCE OF THOSE PONDS THAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO DO. SO I WILL REACH OUT TO THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT TO GET BACK WITH THEM TO TALK THROUGH THAT. AS PART OF YOUR DRAINAGE PLAN, YOU HAVE OPERATIONS AND MAINTENANCE MANUALS THAT ARE INCLUDED. AND THAT OUTLINES HOW OFTEN THINGS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE CLEANED AND WHAT IT TAKES TO

[01:15:04]

THE 116TH STREET. >> THERE IS A STORMWATER

MANAGEMENT FUNCTION... >> YES.

>> TO THE WATER FEATURES ALONG 116TH STREET.

HERE, THOUGH, THIS IS PURELY AN AESTHETIC AMENITY.

>> CORRECT. >> CORRECT.

NO FUNCTIONALITY. >> WELL, THERE MIGHT BE A LITTLE BIT THAT THEY CAN COUNT TOWARDS THEIR DRAINAGE.

>> SURFACE COLLECTION. >> BUT IT IS NOT A MAIN COLLECTOR FOR THEM AS THEY MENTIONED.

THEY WILL HAVE UNDERGROUND DETENTION FOR THEIR PORTION OF

THE SITE. >> OKAY.

I'M ENCOURAGED THAT THROUGH THE LANDSCAPE COMPONENT, WE MAY H HAVE... THAT MAY BE OUR CONNECTION FOR ENFORCEMENT

>> YES. >> AND I THINK I HEARD MR. SHIVELY SAY THAT THIS WOULD... A DIFFERENCE HERE IS THAT THIS WOULD BE A LOCALLY OWNED PROPERTY WHERE THE BRIDGES...

WELL, THE MASTER DEVELOPER IS STILL LOCAL.

BUT NOT. SO THE FACT THAT THE OWNER IS THE BENEFICIARY AND HAS TO LOOK OUT AT THIS WATER FEATURE EVERY DAY MAY ALSO BE AN ADDITIONAL BENEFIT AS WELL AS ADDITIONAL PIECE OF LEVERAGE TO MR. DIERCKMAN'S POINT.

>> WHO IS THE MASTER DEVELOPER YOU ARE REFERRING TO?

>> CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT IT WOULD BE CORNERSTONE.

BUT. MATILY, THE OWNERSHIP WOULD BE

ONE OF THE TENANTS. >> WHO OPENS THOSE PONDS?

IS THAT CORNERSTONE? >> NOT ON 116TH.

NO. IT IS GERSHMAN.

THE MASTER DEVELOPER WAS PITTMAN.

THEN RKHMAN-BROWN. >> THE OWNERS OF THIS PROPOSED MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING ARE GOING TO BE THE TENANTS AND

CORNERSTONE. >> WHO CURRENTLY OWNS THE LAND?

>> THE LAND RIGHT NOW IS CURRENTLY CONTROLLED BY THE

PITTMANS. >> THANK YOU.

THAT WILL PROBABLY HELP. >> RACHEL, REFRESH MY MEMORY.

GOING BACK TO WHEN THIS PUD WAS ORIGINALLY ADOPTED.

WHAT, 10, 12 YEARS AGO. WHAT DOES THE PUD SAY ABOUT PERIMETER LANDSCAPING AND BERMS. THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

ALONG 111TH STREET. AT THE SOUTHERN BOUNDARY OF THE PIECE OF PROPERTY. THE PROPERTY IN QUESTION.

>> I WILL HAVE TO LOOK TO REFRESH MY MEMORY EXACTLY.

I FEEL LIKE THAT WAS DISCUSSED IN DETAIL DURING THE STEDMAN PROJECT. THAT THERE WAS NOTHING TO...

THEY WERE NOT TO REMOVE THEM EXCEPT FOR THE APPROVAL OF THAT CUT-THROUGH FOR THE NEW NORTH-SOUTH STREET.

EVERYTHING WAS TO REMAIN AS IS. BUTLY CHECK WITH DARREN TO MAKE SURE... THE URBAN FORESTER TO MAKE SURE HE HAS APPROVED THE EDGES OF THE PROPERTY ON 111TH THE WAY THAT THEY ARE TODAY. IF THEY ARE NOT, THEN WE WILL GO BACK TO THE LANGUAGE AND MAKE SURE THAT IT IS CORRECT.

>> THERE IS NO FURTHER DISCUSSION OR QUESTIONS, IS THERE A MOTION ON HOW WE WISH TO SEND THIS TO THE COMMERCIAL

COMMITTEE? >> I MOVE THAT WE SEND THIS TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE AND COMING BACK TO FULL PLANNING FOR

APPROVAL. >> DID YOU SAY COME BACK?

THAT IS A GOOD IDEA. >> I'LL SECOND.

>> THANK YOU, MR. CAMPAGNA FOR THE SECOND.

ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, TO SEND THIS TO THE COMMERCIAL MEETING ON FEBRUARY 7 WITH FINAL AUTHORITY RESERVED TO THE FULL

PLAN COMMISSION, SAY AYE. >> AYE.

>> ANY OPPOSED? THAT IS WHAT WILL HAPPEN.

[I. Old Business]

TURNING TO OLD BUSINESS. NEXT ON THE AGENDA IS DOCKET P PZ-... THE APPLICANT SEEKS SITE PLAN AND DESIGN APPROVAL FOR A TWO-STORY BUILDING ON 0.89 ACRES LOCATED AT EAST 116TH STREET.

THE ZONING IS B-3 AND WITHIN THE RANGELINE ROAD OVERLAY DISTRICT.

PETITION IS FILED BY WARREN JOHNSON, THE PROPERTY OWNER.

WELCOME BACK, MR. JOHNSON. >> THANK YOU.

GOOD TO BE HERE AGAIN. I THINK I SHOULD PROBABLY GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY AS TO WHY THIS PROJECT CAME BACK HERE.

WE FIRST MET WITH THE... WITH THIS COMMISSION, NOT THE NEWER MEMBERS BUT THE OLD MEMBERS IN DECEMBER.

[01:20:01]

TO PUT IN THE SIDEWALKS REQUIRED BY THE RANGELINE OVERLAY ZONE.

SO WE SAT DOWN BETWEEN US AND TRIED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WE WEE GOING TO DO. WE PROPOSED BASICALLY, TO REDESIGN THE ENTIRE PROJECT. AND WE EXPLORED THAT WITH RACHEL. THAT NIGHT.

ABOUT 5:30. AND SHE SAID "I LIKE THAT PLAN." SO THE DECISION WAS MADE TO TABLE IT AND TO COME BACK HERE TO PRESENT IT. SO WHAT YOU ARE GOING TO SEE TONIGHT IS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT YOU SAW A MONTH AGO.

THE NEW SITE PLAN LOOKS LIKE THAT.

116TH STREET IS IN THE NORTH.

THIS IS RANGELINE. THE BOULEVARD HERE.

WE ARE NOW BUILDING TWO BUILDINGS.

IT LOOKS LIKE ONE BUILDING. ONE BUILDING HERE.

ONE BUILDING HERE. AND THEN WE ARE DOING, I GUESS YOU CALL IT AN ATRIUM. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE TERMINOLOGY WOULD BE. WITH AN OPEN COURTYARD.

WHICH WOULD FACE THE ROUNDABOUT. AND WOULD PROVIDE A DOMINANT FEATURE ENTRY TO THE BUILDING AND WOULD GIVE THE AESTHETIC VIEW AND WOULD GIVE US THE ABILITY TO LANDSCAPE THAT AREA AND TO PROVIDE A COURTYARD ATMOSPHERE TO THE PROJECT.

ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT WE HAD TO FACE IS THIS IS, IF YOU CAN SEE THIS, THIS SHOWS THE OLD GAS STATION, THE T-TYPE CANOPY, AND RIGHT HERE IN THIS AREA WAS THE OLD TANK FARM.

AND THE UNDERGROUND TANKS WERE TAKEN OUT OF THE GROUND.

THAT HOLE WAS APPROXIMATELY 12 FEET DEEP.

YOU CAN'T FILL THAT WITH DIRT. BECAUSE THE COMPACTION ISSUES FOR THE ROUNDABOUT. THAT AREA WAS FILLED WITH CRUSHED STONE AND RECYCLED CRUSHED CONCRETE.

THAT CREATES A PROBLEM BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT THE SITE PLAN, THAT TANK FARM AREA IS ABOUT IN THIS AREA HERE.

I DON'T THINK WE CAN GET TREES TO GROW OVER CRUSHED ROCK.

WE WILL HAVE TO WORK WITH STAFF TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO LANDSCAPE THAT TO GIVE PROPER AESTHETICS TO THE PROJECT.

FROM THE LANDSCAPE STANDPOINT, THIS IS WHAT WE ARE PROPOSING.

LET'S SEE IF I CAN DO THAT LIKE THAT.

FOR THE NEW MEMBERS, WORKING WITH ENGINEERING, THIS USED TO BE A DITCH OVER HERE. IN THIS AREA.

WE FILLED THAT IN, WORKING WITH JEREMY CASHMAN, THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT, TO ALLEVIATE THE TRAFFIC, GET IT AWAY FROM THE ROUNDABOUT AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE. FOR AN ENTRY ON TO THE SITE.

SO WE HAVE AN ENTRY HERE AND THEN AGAIN, THIS WOULD BE A RIGHT-HAND TURN IN. RIGHT-HAND TURN OUT.

THERE IS A MEDIAN HERE. AND THEN AT THE SOUTH END, WE BASICALLY WOULD BE ACROSS THE STREET FROM KITE WHICH IS THEIR ENTRY. THERE IS NO MEDIAN THERE.

THAT WILL BE A RIGHT-HAND TURN, LEFT-HAND TURN, ET CETERA.

TO THE ROUNDABOUT. WE ARE SHOWING THE LANDSCAPING, TREES, SHRUBS, ALL AROUND THE SITE.

THIS AREA RIGHT HERE CREATES A PROBLEM BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE UTILITIES ARE. UTILITY POLES THERE.

THERE IS A... I HAVE A PICTURE HERE OF THE... ANYWAY, THE CITY PLACED A CONTROL BOX FOR THE STREET LIGHTS APPROXIMATELY SIX FEET FROM THE CURB. WE HAVE CAN'T DO A SIDEWALK.

BUT THIS PROJECT, BY DOING THIS, WE MOVE THE BUILDINGS BACK OFF THE RIGHT OF WAY. WE ARE STILL WITHIN THE TEN-FOOT LIMIT. OF THE RANGELINE OVERLAY ZONE.

WE ARE THEN ABLE TO GET THE SIDEWALKS THAT ARE REQUIRED BY THE OVERLAY ZONE. WE ARE CLOSE TO MEETING THE PARKING REQUIREMENTS, BUT WE HAVE BEEN TOLD BY REDEVELOPMENT COMMISSION THAT THE PARKING GARAGE ACROSS THE STREET COULD BE USED BY OUR EMPLOYEES, CUSTOMERS, ET CETERA.

[01:25:02]

WE HAVE NOT COUNTED IN THE STACK UP HERE TO HERE IN THE DRIVE-THROUGH LANE. OUR...

THIS BUILDING WILL BE A SINGLING-STORY BUILDING.

IT WILL LOOK LIKE A TWO-STORY BUILDING FROM THE STREET.

IT WILL BE A FIVE OR SIX-FOOT WALL.

THAT... ANY HVAC UNITS WOULD BE PLACED TOWARD THE BACK OF THIS BUILDING. WILL BE SCREENED PROPERLY SO NOBODY WILL SEE IT. AS FAR AS BUILDING ELEVATIONS, THIS IS STILL A WORK IN PROGRESS.

BUT THIS IS 116TH STREET. THIS IS RANGELINE.

THIS WOULD BEES A TWO-STORY OFFICE BUILDING RETAIL BUILDING.

THIS WOULD BE A SINGLE-STORY PROPOSED BANK.

THIS WOULD BE THE ENTRY INTO THE BUILDING WITH THE COURTYARD ON THE ROUNDABOUT. WHICH WOULD BE LANDSCAPED AND WE WILL WORK WITH STAFF ON GETTING THOSE ISSUES RESOLVED TO THEIR SATISFACTION. THE BRICK WE ARE USING, THREE COLORS OF BRICK. THE BUILDING WILL BE COMPLETELY ALL BRICK, ALL FOUR SIDES. WE THINK IT LOOKS PRETTY GOOD.

OF COURSE, WE ARE PREJUDICED. I HOPE THE PLANNING COMMISSION LIKES IT. WE HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO RECEIVE ANY FUNDS FROM THE CITY, AND LIKE MANY DEVELOPERS ALONG RANGELINE, THIS IS ALL TOTALLY SELF-FUNDED.

THAT HAS CREATED SOME REAL ISSUES FOR US.

AS YOU ALL KNOW, INTEREST RATES HAVE JUMPED DRAMATICALLY.

AND WE ARE UNDER THE GUN TO GET THIS THING APPROVED FOR FINANCING PURPOSES. AND SO WE ARE RESPECTFULLY ASKING YOUR APPROVAL OF THIS PROJECT SUBJECT TO THE FACT THAT WE WILL WORK WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION STAFF TO OVERCOME ALL OF THE ISSUES SUCH AS LIGHTING AND SIGNAGE.

OTHER THAN THAT, THAT IS... AND THE LANDSCAPING.

THOSE ARE THE ONLY ISSUES THAT WE HAVE YET TO OVERCOME.

WE CAN DO THAT PRETTY QUICKLY. >> ANY QUESTIONS FROM ANYBODY?

>> THANK YOU, MR. JOHNSON. I'LL SKIP THE DEPARTMENT REPORT.

EXCUSE ME. THE COMMITTEE CHAIR REPORT AND GO STRAIGHT TO THE DEPARTMENT REPORT.

>> THANK YOU. AGAIN.

RACHEL KIESLING, DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES.

WE HAVE BEEN WORKING HARD WITH THE PETITIONER TO MAKE THESE CHANGES AND WORK TOGETHER IN ORDER TO HELP THE SITE FLOW BETTER AND IMPROVE THE BUILDING AESTHETIC AND PROVIDE MORE AREAS FOR PEDESTRIANS. THE BUILDING PLACEMENT LAYOUT IS GENERALLY THE SAME. IT IS JUST SEPARATED NOW, AS WE SAW INSTEAD OF ONE BIG BUILDING. IT IS BROKEN OUT.

NOW THERE IS AN ATRIUM AND A COURTYARD SPACE.

MORE AREA FOR PEDESTRIANS. WHICH IS REQUIRED, AND SO A LOT OF THE VARIANCES THAT THEY PREVIOUS LIP NEEDED ARE NOW ITEMS THAT ARE MET. AND THE VARIANCES ARE NOT NEEDED. THERE ARE STILL QUITE A FEW VARIANCES THAT ARE NEEDED. BUT THESE ARE GENERALLY ITEMS THAT WE ARE IN SUPPORT OF. THIS IS A TINY SITE.

WHICH WE ARE HAPPY TO HAVE A TWO-STORY BUILDING COMING TO THE SITE WHEN, YOU KNOW, WE RECEIVE A LOT OF PUSHBACK FROM A LOT OF DEVELOPERS ALONG RANGELINE THAT DON'T WANT TO DO TWO STORIES AND BRING IT UP TO THE STREET. AND WE HAVE NOT HAD TO PUSH FOR ANY OF THOSE KIND OF ITEMS HERE. WE HAVE WORKED TOGETHER TO CHANGE THE BUILDING MATERIALS. TO BE ALL BRICK.

100% BRICK. ON THE FRONT AND THE BACK.

AND IT WILL BE THREE COLORS OF BRICK.

WE REALLY LIKE THE WAY THAT THE BUILDING NOW LOOKS WITH THE WAY THAT THE DIFFERENT COLORS OF BRICK DEFINE THE DIFFERENT AREAS OF THE BUILDING. LIKE MR. JOHNSON SAID, THERE ARE A FEW ITEMS THAT WE COULD STILL WORK ON THROUGH OUR PROJECT DOCS REVIEW AFTER THIS MEETING.

WE ARE IN SUPPORT OF THE PROJECT.

LIKE I SAID, WE HAVE DONE A LOT OF WORK OVER THE LAST MONOTO GET IT TO THIS POINT. WE ARE SATISFIED WITH WHERE IT IS AT. WE LIKE THE LOOK OF THE BUI BUILDING. THE SITE PLAN HAS CHANGED IN POSITIVE WAYS. THEY REALLY ARE MEETING AS MANY OF THE ITEMS THAT THEY CAN, AND THE VARIANCES THAT THEY NEED,

[01:30:01]

SO I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT YOU APPROVE THIS TONIGHT.

SUBJECT TO THE PETITIONER CONNING TO WORK WITH STAFF ON THE FINAL ITEMS NEEPPEDDED... NEEDED TO COMPLETE OUR REVIEW.

SUCH AS URBAN FORESTR SIGN-OFF. AND GETTING THE VARIANCES THAT ARE NEEDED. ACCORDING TO MEET THE OVERLAY REQUIREMENTS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. RACHEL.

MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION? CHRISTINE?

>> JUST A QUICK COMMENT. THIS IS MUCH IMPROVED.

THIS LOOKS SO MUCH BETTER, SO THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR WORK ON THIS. IT IS VERY MUCH IMPROVED.

THAN THE ORIGINAL DRAFT THAT WE SAW BACK HERE.

SO THANKS. >> SUE IN.

>> RACHEL, AM I UNDERSTANDING... THE PETITIONER, THAT THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT IS IN COMPLETE AGREEMENT WITH THE IN-OUT THERE ON RANGELINE ROAD? THAT CLOSE TO THE ROUNDABOUT? AND THEY DON'T SEE ANY PROBLEM... I MEAN, THAT IS A BUSY ROUNDABOUT. NOW YOU HAVE PEOPLE GOING OUT, TURNING LEFT. YOU HAVE PEOPLE COMING OUT OF THE ROUNDABOUT. THAT HAS BEEN APPROVED?

>> YES. THEY HAVE WORKED WEST WITH JEREMY ON... JEREMY CASHMAN, THE ENGINEERING DIRECTOR, ON THE RIGHT-OF-WAY TAKEN, THE DESIGN OF THE CURVE OF THE ROAD.

AND THE WAY THAT THE ROUNDABOUT HAD TO SHIFT SOUTH, AND THIS SITE TOOK THE BRUNT OF ADJUSTMENTS FROM, LIKE, THE ENTIRE RANGELINE REDESIGN. PRETTY MUCH.

I THINK PEOPLE WILL BE VERY SMART.

THEY WILL TURN RIGHT AND GO AROUND THE ROUNDABOUT AND COME BACK. BECAUSE THAT IS PROBABLY THE

EASIEST WAY TO MAKE IT HAPPEN. >> THAT WOULD BE THE SAFEST THING. I MEAN, THAT WO WOULD BE MY RECOMMENDATION. I'M NOT ENGINEERING.

YOU COULD MAKE THAT PART OF YOUR RECOMMENDATION FOR THE PROJECT.

I CAN DOUBLE-CHECK WITH THEM TO SEE IF THAT WOULD BE BETTER.

THAN THE PROPOSAL. >> IF THERE IS ANYBODY ELSE THAT AGREES THAT WAY AND WANTS TO MAKE PART OF IT, FEEL FREE TO WEIGH. IN I THINK IT IS INSANE THAT YOU CAN TURN LEFT OUT OF THERE. YOU CAN BARELY GET UP RANGELINE ROAD AND TURN INTO PLACES RIGHT NOW BETWEEN 116TH AND CARMEL DRIVE. I MEAN, WITH THE NEW ROUNDABOUT, IT IS... I DIDN'T WANT TO ADD ANYTHING ELSE THERE.

THANK YOU. >> I CONCUR AND WAS GOING TO BRING UP THE SAME THING. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT PART OF

THE FINAL MOTION. >> THERE IS NO MEDIAN IN FRONT OF EITHER OF THESE ACCESS POINTS? NO MEDIAN ON RANGELINE? NO MEDIAN ON 116TH?

>> THERE IS ON 116TH. IT IS THE RANGELINE ONE IN

QUESTION. >> THE 116TH MEDIAN FROM THE ROUNDABOUT DOES EXTEND THAT FAR EAST?

>> YES. >> OKAY.

>> I'M GOING TO DOUBLE-CHECK NOW AGAIN.

>> RIGHT IN, RIGHT OUT. YUP.

MR. AASEN? >> THANK YOU.

I DID WATCH THE MEETING IN DECEMBER.

I AGREE THAT THIS IS AN IMPROVEMENT.

I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR WORKING WITH THE CITY.

I KNOW THIS IS A DIFFICULT SITE, BUT IT IS AN IMPORTANT SITE, SO IT IS IMPORTANT THAT WE GET IT RIGHT.

IT IS ONE OF THE KIND OF GATEWAYS TO THE HEART OF OUR DOWNTOWN, HEADING INTO THE RANGELINE DISTRICT.

I DO HAVE SOME QUESTIONS, THOUGH, ABOUT PEDESTRIAN CROSSING. BECAUSE YOU KNOW, WHEN THE... TO THE WEST, THE RESIDENTS AND OFFICES GO IN THERE, AND WITH THERE BEING SOME RETAIL, I IMAGINE THERE COULD BE A PEDESTRIAN CROSSING. WHAT IS YOUR THOUGHTS ON HOW

THAT WOULD WORK RIGHT NOW? >> SO AT THE ROUNDABOUT, THERE ARE... I BELIEVE THEY ARE RAISED CROSSWALKS AT ALL THE CORNERS.

AROUND THE ROUNDABOUT. THAT IS WHERE PEOPLE WOULD BE DIRECTED TO GO IF THEY WANTED TO CROSS WESTFIELD OR RANGELINE OR 116TH STREET. THAT WOULD STRICTLY BE AT THOSE CROSSINGS THROUGH THE ROUNDABOUT.

AND THEN, LIKE, IN THE MIDDLE IS A RESTING AREA.

AND THEN IT GOES BEYOND... LIKE, A REFUGE IN THE MIDDLE.

THEN IT GOES ON. THAT IS WHERE PEOPLE WOULD HAVE

TO GO TO. >> JUST IN MY EXPERIENCE, I THINK WE SHOULD MAYBE KEEP AN EYE ON THAT IN THE FUTURE.

I FEEL LIKE THE MID-BLOCK CROSSINGS HAVE BEEN A LOT MORE

[01:35:01]

THAT IS SOMETHING THE CITY CAN ADJUST AS TIME GOES ON.

IF WE SEE THAT BECOMING AN ISSUE.

I WOULD JUST ENCOURAGE THOSE, TO KEEP AN EYE ON THAT GOING

FORWARD. >> IT IS A LITTLE UNCONVENTIONAL FOR THIS BODY TO ACT, I GUESS, THIS QUICKLY ON THIS PETITION.

AS WE HAVE HEARD OVER AND OVER AGAIN, THIS SITE IS FULL OF CHALLENGES. AND ANY IDEA THAT WE CONVENTIONALLY RAISE WITH RESPECT TO THIS PROJECT, THERE IS A TRAFFIC SIGNAL CONTROL BOX OR THERE IS BURIED GRAVEL, OR THERE IS FLOOD PLANE. THAT MAKES THIS SITE ANYTHING BUT ORDINARY. I THINK THIS IS ONE OF THOSE CASES WHERE IT IS A GAME OF BACK-A-MOLE.

MAYBE BEST PLAYED BY THE DEPARTMENT AND THE PETITIONER.

SOMEWHAT OUTSIDE THE LEVEL OF SCRUTINY THAT WE WOULD NORM NORMALLY... THAT WOULD NORMALLY BE APPLIED BY THIS BODY.

I EMPATHIZE WITH PETITIONER WITH RESPECT TO THE URGENCY.

COSTS ARE ONLY GOING UP. AND I THINK WE HAVE SEEN WITH THE REVISED PLAN, YOU KNOW, A VERY SUCCESSFUL AND GOOD-FAITH EFFORT TO MOVE IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

I AM COMFORTABLE, YOU KNOW, ADDRESSING THIS PETITION THIS EVENING. IF THAT IS THE WILL OF THE BODY.

>> MR. DIERCKMAN? >> YEAH.

I'M SURPRISED BY YOUR COMMENTS, BRAD: I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU, AND I'M SURPRISED WE ARE NOT GOING TO SEND THIS TO THE COMMERCIAL... BACK TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE.

BECAUSE IT IS SUCH AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY.

AND LOCATION AND OUR CITY. THEN WE HAVE A BUNCH OF VARIANCE THAT IS ARE GOING TO BE NECESSARY.

I DON'T KNOW. WHEN THIS COMES TO THE BZA, THERE IS GOING TO BE... IT IS GOING TO BE YEA OR NAY.

I FEEL LIKE A LOT OF TIMES, WE RELY ON OUR BZA TOO MUCH TO HAVE TO MAKE WHAT COULD BE CONSIDERED TO BE PLANNING COMMISSION TYPE OF DECISIONS, YOU KNOW, AT THE B ST A VERSUS THE PLANNING COMMISSION LEVEL. I'M KIND OF HARD-PRESSED TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF MOVING THIS TO... ON WITHOUT GOING BACK TO COMMITTEE.

I'M BRAND NEW HERE. MAYBE THIS IS THE WAY WE DO BUSINESS NOW. IN CARMEL.

>> THE BZA IS A DIFFERENT BODY. I WOULD SUGGEST THAT THE BULK OF THE VARIANCES THAT ARE NECESSARY AND MORE MAY COME, ARE GOING TO BE DUE TO THAT ONE CATEGORY OF UNIQUE SITE CHALLENGES.

RATHER THAN DESIGN... AGGRESSIVE DESIGN FEATURES.

>> I MUST BE MISSING PART OF THE PACKAGE OR SOMETHING.

BECAUSE IS THIS THE ONLY RENDERING WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN?

>> NO. FOR THE LEGACY MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION, THERE IS A FULL DEVELOPMENT PLAN PACT PROVIDED.

>> IN DECEMBERMENT.% >> IT HAS CHANGED.

>> I CONCUR WITH LEO. THIS OUGHT TO GO BACK TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE. THEY HAVE TIME TO GET THIS

TOGETHER AND REVIEW IT. >> I DON'T LIKE TO DELAY PEOPLE.

ON THE OTHER HAND, IT HAS TO BE DONE PROPERLY.

>> TWO WEEKS OUT. IT IS TOO IMPORTANT.

I JUST FEEL LIKE THERE WERE SOME THINGS THAT JUST HAVEN'T BEEN ADDRESSED. THAT IS MY OPINION.

AND IT COULD BE DONE IN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS.

AND IT COULD BE BUTTONED AT COMMERCIAL ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

>> SO HAVING NOT SEEN THE OTHER PACKAGE, I'M GOING TO ABSTAIN FROM THIS. SO YOU KNOW WHY.

I DON'T FEEL I'M REALLY IN A POSITION AT THIS POINT, TO VOTE

ON IT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. >> I WILL ALSO ABSTAIN.

>> IS THERE A MOTION? ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?

>> I WANT TO BE CLEAR ON THE OPTIONS.

THE OPTIONS ARE TO SEND THIS BACK TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE WITH THE COMMITTEE HAVING FINAL RECOMMENDATION...

>> OR NOT. >> THAT IS ONE OPTION.

SEND IT BACK TO COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE WITH THE REQUIREMENT THAT IT COME BACK TO THE FULL PLAN COMMISSION.

I'M NOT SUPPORTING THAT OPTION. I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THE OPTIONS ARE. THAT WOULD BE AN OPTION, BUT IT IS NOT IN MY OPINION, A DESIRABLE ONE.

>> RIGHT. >> THE THIRD OPTION IS TO JUST

[01:40:02]

THAT STRAIGHT. >> AND THE FOURTH IS TO REJECT

IT TONIGHT. >> KAIVMENT I DIDN'T HEAR ANY COMMENTS THAT WOULD LEAD ME TO THINK THAT THAT WAS A THOUGHT PROCESS GOING THROUGH ANYBODY'S MINDS.

BUT YES THAT, WOULD BE THE FOURTH OPTION.

>> IF I MAY, WE HAVE BEEN LIVING AND BREATHING THIS PROJECT, MR. JOHNSON, AND I FOR THE LAST FEW WEEKS.

I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHAT ELSE I COULD DO TO MAKE IT MORE COMPLETE OTHER THAN A PHYSICAL PACKET THAT SHOWS YOU EVERYTHING IN, LIKE, ONE PACKET. WE HAVE COMMITMENT FROM THE PETITIONER ON THE BACK SIDE OF THE BUILDING WILL BE THE SAME MATERIALS AND DESIGN LEVEL AS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING.

THE ISSUES THAT WE HAD PREVIOUSLY WHICH WERE ABOUT THE OVERBRANDING OF THE BUILDING FOR THE BANK TENANT HAVE BEEN REMOVED FROM THE BUILDING, SO THAT WAS ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUES THAT WE HAD PREVIOUSLY. PREVIOUSLY, THE ISSUE WAS THE MATERIAL WAS NOT CORRECT. IT WAS NOT A REAL BRICK.

NOW WE HAVE 100% REAL BRICK ON ALL FOUR SIDES OF THE BUILDING.

I JUST WOULD LET YOU KNOW THAT, AGAIN, THAT THE VARIANCES THEY NEED, THERE ISN'T REALLY ANYTHING ELSE I CAN DO TO CHANGE THE BUILDING WITH THE SITE THAT WE HAVE, WITH THE RESTRICTIONS THAT WE HAVE. TO MAKE ANY OF THOSE GO AWAY.

OTHER THAN PERHAPS THE SIGNAGE. BUT I CAN ALWAYS WORK ON SIGNAGE. WITH THE PETITIONER TO, LIKE, TRY TO MAKE SOMETHING WORK DIFFERENTLY OR, LIKE, BRING SOMETHING UP THEY HAVEN'T THOUGHT OF BEFORE.

TO MAKE SOMETHING WORK FOR THEM.

AS BRAD SAID EARLIER, IT IS REALLY... IT IS TRUE HARDSHIP BECAUSE OF THE RESTRAINTS OF THE SITE.

SO I JUST... HONESTLY, I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH MORE WE COULD DO AT COMMITTEE IF WE POSTPONE IT. THAT IS ALL.

>> WOULD THIS BE ON THE AGENDA FOR THE JANUARY BZA MEETING?

>> NO. THEY ARE NOT READY FOR THAT.

THEY HAVE NOT MADE PUBLIC NOTICE FOR THE JANUARY MEETING.

>> SO THE VARIANCES AT THE EARLIEST, THE VARIANCES COULDN'T BE GRANTED UNTIL THE FOURTH WEEK OF FEBRUARY.

>> CORRECT. >> SO... BUT THE PLAN COMMISSION PORTION IS, I WOULD SAY RELATIVELY COMPLETE.

NOW. >> COMPLETE, BUT NOT VETTED AS THOROUGHLY AS I'M HEARING MANY WOULD PREFER.

SO IS THERE AN EFFECTIVE DELAY IN THE PROCESS IF WE WERE TO SEND THIS TO COMMITTEE? I GUESS I'M HEARING MAYBE NOT.

>> I BELIEVE IF THE PETITIONER WANTED TO SPEAK TO THAT, THEY WOULD GIVE YOU A REASON FOR AN EXTRA... AN EXTRA REASON FOR

SEEKING THIS APPROVAL TONIGHT. >> MR. JOHNSON?

>> I PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED THE FINANCING AND FINANCING COSTS HAVE SKYROCKETED, AS YOU ALL KNOW.

I WAS ABLE TO SECURE FINANCING COMMITMENT SEVERAL MONTHS AGO, BUT ONE OF THE CONDITIONS WAS THAT I HAD TO GET THE APPROVAL FROM THE CITY OF CARMEL BY JANUARY 31.

IF I DON'T GET THE APPROVAL OF THIS PROJECT SUBJECT TO WORKING WITH STAFF, I DON'T THINK I CAN PROCEED WITH THE THIS PROJECT.

BECAUSE OF FINANCING COSTS. I MEAN, INTEREST RATES ARE UP 4%, EVERYBODY. ON A PROJECT OF THIS MAGNITUDE, THAT REALLY JUST KIND OF KILLS CASH FLOW.

I'M NOT GOING TO GET ANY ASSISTANCE FROM THE CITY ON THIS PROJECT. I'M NOT GETTING ANY FREE MONEY.

ANY FREE HELP. I'M KIND OF AT A DEAD END.

I REALLY AM. AND I LIVE HERE, GUYS.

I LIVE IN CARMEL. I HAVE LIVED HERE A LONG TIME.

I TRY TO BE A GOOD CITIZEN. RACHEL HAS BEEN GREAT TO WORK WITH. I THINK WE CAN RESOLVE THESE ISSUES. I REALLY DO.

I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT IT. I NEED TO BE ABLE TO GET MY

[01:45:01]

FINANCING TIED DOWN. >> SO AN OPTION WOULD BE TO MOVE TO APPROVE TONIGHT AS A COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE, SUBJECT TO APPROVAL BY STAFF FOR ALL OF THE OUTSTANDING ISSUES AND THE NET EFFECT OF THAT IS IF STAFF DOESN'T APPROVE ISSUES, IT IS NOT GOING TO PROCEED. CORRECT?

>> YES. AS WELL AS IF THE BZA DOES NOT APPROVE THE VARIANCES. THEN IT CAN NO PROCEED.

... CANNOT PROCEED. >> WELL, GIVEN THE EXPLANATION THAT THERE IS NOT MUCH MORE FOR THE DEVELOPMENT TO BE CONSIDERED AND THE OUTSTANDING ISSUES ARE ADMINISTRATIVE, PROSEED YURL, COMPLIANCE ISSUES AND ZONING ISSUES, THEN WITH THAT UNDERSTANDING, I WOULD MOVE THAT THE PLAN COMMISSION APPROVE THIS TONIGHT SUBJECT TO THE DEPARTMENT'S FINAL APPROVAL OF

ALL OF THE SITE PLANS. >> SECOND.

>> AND ALSO BZA VARIANCES AND DID YOU WANT YOUR... THE

RIGHT-IN ONLY? >> YES.

SO SUBJECT TO BZA APPROVAL AND A REVISIT OF THE IN AND OUT ON THE

RANGELINE ROAD. >> RANGELINE.

NOT 116TH. >> I'M SORRY.

>> THE VARIANCES ARE REQUIRED... IF THERE IS A NEED FOR A VARIANCE, THE VARIANCE REQUIREMENT EXISTS REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE MAKE A CONDITION OR OF THIS MOTION OR NOT.

HEARING MR. JOHNSON'S NEED WITH RESPECT TO FINANCING, I WOULD SUGGEST WE MAY BE SAFER LEAVING THAT CONDITION OUT BECAUSE HE CAN'T FIX THAT BY JANUARY 31. IN CASE HIS BANK TAKES A

STRINGENT VIEW. >> OKAY.

TAKE TWO. COACH ME ALONG SO THAT I'M ENCOMPASSING WHAT YOU WANT. I MOVE THAT THE PLAN COMMISSION APPROVE THE PROJECT SUBJECT TO FINAL APPROVAL BY THE DEPARTMENT FOR ALL OF THE OUTSTANDING ISSUES AND ADDING THE ISSUE OF IN-AND-OUT ON RANGELINE ROAD BEING REVISITED.

IS THAT GOOD? DOES THAT GET IT?

>> YOUR SECOND. >> THANK YOU.

>> I'M LOOKING AT COUNSEL. HAVE YOU HAPPY WITH THE WAY I

WORDED THAT MOTION? >> SUBJECT TO ENGINEERING APPROVAL OF THE IN-AND-OUT ISSUE IN.

>> YES. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I MEANT.

YES. OKAY.

>> I HEARD A MOTION AND A SECOND.

>> MR. PRESIDENT, POINT OF ORDER.

I WANT TO REMIND YOU ALL SINCE MR. KIRSH AND MR. HILL ARE NOT HERE AND ONLY FIVE PEOPLE ARE VOTING, AS WAS INDICATED EARLIER, THE VOTE HAS TO BE UNANIMOUS IN ORDER TO BE APPROVED. BECAUSE OTHERWISE, THERE WILL

NOT BE A MAJORITY. >> WE NEED FIVE AFFIRM TY VOTES FOR THE MOTION TO PASS. YUP.

SO IS THE DEPARTMENT WILLING TO SHARE WITH THE FULL COMMISSION JUST BY EMAIL OR OTHER COMMUNICATION WHERE YOU STAND ON THOSE ISSUES ONCE YOU THINK EVERYTHING IS FINALIZED?

>> YES. ABSOLUTELY.

>> OKAY. THAT IS THE CONDITION...

NOT AS A CONDITION. BUT JUST FOR COMMUNICATION AND INFORMATION PURPOSES. ALL RIGHT.

WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND ON THE FLOOR.

ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE.

>> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? THE MOTION DOES CARRY. 5-0.

>> WITH TWO ABSTENTIONS. >> THANK YOU, MR. JOHNSON.

[J. New Business]

>> WE HAVE ONE ORDER OF NEW BUSINESS.

THAT IS DOCKET PZ-022-ADLS. TRU HOTEL CARMEL.

THE APPLICANT SEEKS DESIGN APPROVAL FOR A 26-ROOM HOTEL ON 1.13ICIC ACRES. DEVELOPMENT PLAN APPROVAL WAS GRANTED UNDER DOCKET 19060018DB. THE SITE LOCATED AT 1216 NORTH MERIDIAN STREET MERE THE RITZ CHARLES.

THE OWNERS, DORA HOTEL GROUP. MR. WINSLOW?

>> THANK YOU, MEMBERS. I'M BACK.

LAST BUT NOT LEAST. I'LL GIVE IT A SECOND HERE TO

[01:50:04]

EXCELLENT. NATHAN WINSLOW WITH AMERICAN STRUCTURE POINT. AGAIN, OFFICE AT 9025 RIVER ROAD. IN INDIANAPOLIS.

I HAVE WITH ME HERE TONIGHT VINCE DORA FROM DORA HOSPITALITY GROUP. HE REPRESENTS THE OWNERSHIP AS WELL AS THE ARCHITECT OF RECORD ON THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT.

I CAN GIVE YOU QUICK SNAP SHOT OF EXACTLY WHERE THIS IS AT.

AS MENTIONED, IMMEDIATELY NORTH OF THE RITZ CHARLES ON THE WEST SIDE OF MERIDIAN STREET. THERE IS A MEDICAL OFFICE WILTDING IMMEDIATELY TO THE NORTH.

AGAIN, THIS WAS APPROVED PREVIOUSLY AS A DEVELOPMENT PLAN FOR PART OF THIS MASTER PLANNED LOT.

ACROSS THE STREET IS THE WAGNER-REESE BUILDING.

HERE IS A SNAP SHOT OF THE PARTICULAR PROPERTY.

ACTUALLY, I'M GOING TO GO FORWARD ONE MORE.

YOU CAN SEE THE AERIAL UNDERNEATH.

THIS PARTICULAR SITE PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING EXCEPT FOR THIS BUILDING HAS BEEN CONSTRUCTED ON THIS SITE.

IT HAS BEEN LEFT AS ESSENTIALLY, A BUILDING PAD.

MASTER PLAN FOR THIS. WE WILL BE MAKING A FEW MODIFICATIONS IN THE PARKING LOT ALONG THE WEST SIDE OF THE BUILDING. TO ACCOMMODATE THE DROP-OFF ENTRANCE OF. THIS AGAIN, DETENTION.

PRETTY MUCH ALL UTILITIES ARE MASTER-PLANNED FOR THIS SITE.

EVERYTHING IS AS CLOSE AS READY AS YOU ARE GOING TO GET FOR THIS TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT. I KNOW WE DID RECEIVE A FEW COMMENTS FROM THE NEIGHBORS. LY LEAVE... I WILL LEAVE THE TO ANYBODY ELSE WHO WANTS TO SPEAK TO THAT FROM OUR GROUP.

I THINK MAYBE AT THIS TIME, IT IS A GOOD TIME TO TURN IT OVER TO JOHN TO TALK ABOUT THE ARCHITECTURAL SIDE OF THINGS.

I KNOW WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH STAFF ON SOME OF.

THIS WE HAVE A MEETING SCHEDULED TOMORROW, ACTUALLY, WITH RACHEL AND HER TEAM TO DIVE INTO THIS DEEPER AND GET ADDITIONAL INPUT.

JOHN CAN SPEAK TO THIS AND THE INSPIRATION AND WHERE WE ARE AT.

>> THANK YOU, NATHAN. COMMISSIONERS, STAFF, THANKS FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME BEFORE YOU TONIGHT.

I'M JUST GOING TO FRAME THIS A LITTLE BIT.

THE MAIN PURPOSE THAT I HAVE COME HERE FOR, AND I SHOULD PROBABLY STATE FOR THE RECORD WHERE I'M FROM.

MY NAME IS JOHN HEFNER, OWNER OF STIP'S EDGE ARCHITECTS.

1017 EAST HIGHWAY 12 IN MINNESOTA.

WE ARE A COMPANY THAT SPECIALIZES IN THE DESIGN OF HOTELS AND RESORTS. I CAME HERE TONIGHT TO LISTEN REALLY. WE HAVE SPENT TIME GOING BACK AND FORTH A LITTLE BIT WITH STAFF.

WE WORKED A LOT WITH NATHAN AND HIS GROUP AND HAVE WORKED FOR MANY YEARS WITH VINCENT AND HIS COMPANY.

AND ONE THING THAT WE FIND WHEN WE DESIGN A HOTEL IS THAT IN MANY CASES, SUCH AS THIS, THERE ARE VARIOUS GROUPS OF PEOPLE THAT NEED TO HAVE INPUT IN WHAT THESE BUILDINGS LOOK LIKE, HOW THEY FUNCTION. PRIMARILY, HOW THEY FIT INTO THE CONTEXT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND SO WHAT... AND I'M PROBABLY JUST GOING TO JUMP RIGHT AHEAD TO A COUPLE OF RENDERINGS THAT WE DID, AND THIS WAS REALLY IN RESPONSE TO THE MEETING THAT WE HAD AND SOME OF THE INPUT GATHERED THERE.

IS IT JUST THE RIGHT ARROW? SURE.

THERE WE GO. YEAH.

SO AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO IS MARRY THE NEEDS OF THE COMMISSIONERS SUCH AS YOU, THE NEIGHBORHOOD, DEVELOPERS SUCH AS MR. DORA, AND TRY PACKAGE THAT ALL

[01:55:04]

I MIGHT BE CLOSE. I MIGHT BE DEAD-ON.

I DON'T KNOW. SO I'LL REPEAT WHAT MY OPENING STATEMENT WAS. I'M HERE TO LISTEN.

AND I'M HOPING TO GET FEEDBACK BOTH FROM STAFF, FROM YOU AS COMMISSIONERS, AND I DON'T BELIEVE THIS IS AN ACTUAL PUBLIC HEARING. BUT I KNOW SOME OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD FOLKS HAVE CONTACTED STAFF WITH CONCERNS AS WELL. JUST A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE BRAND ITSELF. TRU HOTEL IS A SELECT SERVICE BRAND. IN OTHER WORDS, IT IS TRANSIENT IN NATURE. IT FOCUSES ON SERVING A MIX OF BUSINESS AND LEISURE TRAVELERS. WITH MORE INFLUENCE BEING ON BUSINESS TRAVEL. IT IS A RATHER SIMPLE HOTEL.

IT IS ECONOMICAL TO DEVELOP. BUT YET THE BRAND HALLMARKS REALLY SUGGEST SOME VERY STRONG, BOLD CLEAN-LINED STATEMENTS THAT THE BRAND ITSELF IS DESIGNED TO BE ASYMMETRICAL IN NATURE.

AND ONE OF THE FEATURES THAT THE BRAND OFFERS TO DEVELOPERS IS THAT IT IS AFFORDABLE TO CONSTRUCT.

IT IS ACTUALLY DESIGNED TO BE PRIMARILY AN EFFACE BUILDING.

WHAT I HAVE DONE IS TRY TO BRING IN SOME OF THE ZONING REQUIREMENTS. SOME OF WHAT I HAVE HEARD FROM STAFF AND INTRODUCED OTHER MATERIALS INTO THE MIX.

THE BUILDING, AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW... AND I DON'T KNOW IF...

YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THE LIT LITTLE... SO OOPS.

NO. I DIDN'T MEAN TO DO THAT.

THAT IS OKAY. NO.

THIS IS OKAY. SO EVERYTHING YOU SEE THAT IS DARK LIKE THIS, INSTEAD OF EFIS, IT IS EITHER GOING TO BE A METAL PANEL OR A CORE PANEL SYSTEM. FORMING THE EXTERIOR CLADDING.

EVERYTHING ON THE GRADE LEVEL DOWN HERE IS STONE.

IT IS A CULTURED STONE. IT IS REAL STONE.

I MEAN, IT IS SIMILAR TO BRICK IN THAT IT IS A MANUFACTURED PRODUCT, BUT IT IS A BLEND OF TWO DIFFERENT KINDS OF STONE.

ONE BEING A VERY LARGE FORMAT LIMESTONE TYPE OF UNIT.

IN THIS CASE, 18 BY 24 STACK BOND UNIT.

THE OTHER, THE DARKER IS MORE OF A STACKED STONE.

IT IS CALLED AN ASHLER LOOK. ALL OF THIS IS ACCENTED BY...

I'M NOT SURE HOW TO GO BACK. HOW DO I GO BACK? YUP. THERE WE GO.

AND MATERIALS SUCH AS THIS BANDING AT THE ENTRY CANOPY, WHICH WILL BE METAL. SO IN THE END, AND EACH FACADE IS DIFFERENT. THE BUILDING AS A WHOLE, IS A

[02:00:03]

IT IS PRIOR PRIMARILY STONE AND METAL PANELS.

AND GLAZING. NOW, I HAVE HEARD A FEW DIFFERENT THINGS. I HAVE HEARD WE WANT A BOLD STATEMENT, AND I HAVE HEARD WE WANT A NO STATEMENT.

THERE IS A LOT OF IN-BETWEEN GROUND THERE.

I TRIED TO KEEP THIS TO A TONED-DOWN BOLD STATEMENT.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT EVEN EXISTS.

I GAVE IT A SHOT. I CHOSE TO KEEP SOME OF THE BOLD COLORS THAT COME FROM THE BRAND. I CHOSE TO KEEP THE ASYMMETRY WHICH COMES FROM THE BRAND. BOTH ARE HALLMARKS OF THE BRAND.

WE WOULD MEET WITH SOME RESISTANCE THAT WE COULD PROBABLY OVERCOME, BUT IT IS SOMETHING THEY PREFER TO SEE.

SO WITH THAT, I TOLD YOU I CAME HERE TO LISTEN, SO I'M GOING TO DO THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR IF WE WE WERE... IF I'M CLOSE, NOT CLOSE, OR SOMEWHERE IN BETWEEN.

BECAUSE I THINK THE PLAN IS TO COME BACK WITH A REVISED PACKAGE. AND AT ONE POINT, WE WERE CONSIDERING PULLING THIS FROM THE AGENDA.

BUT ACTUALLY, MR. DORA SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT? LET'S GO LISTEN. LET'S SEE WHAT THEY HAVE SO SAY.

LET'S GET ALL THE INPUT WE CAN. SO THAT IS WHAT WE ARE HERE FOR.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU.

NATHAN, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING FURTHER? ALL RIGHT. WE WILL TURN TO THE DEPARTMENT.

>> THANK YOU. AGAIN, FOR THE RECORD, RACHEL KIESLING, PLANNER WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES. THIS IS AN ADLS ITEM ONLY.

WHICH IS WHY THERE IS NO PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS PROJECT.

TO GIVE YOU SOME BACKGROUND, THIS BUILDING HAS BEEN ANTICIPATED FOR A FEW YEARS NOW. THE FIRST APPROVAL FOR THIS SITE WAS BACK IN 2018 FOR A USE VARIANCE TO ALLOW A HOTEL ON ALL FLOORS OF THE BUILDING RATHER THAN JUST THE SECOND FLOOR AND ABOVE. THE MERIDIEN CORRIDOR DISTRICT ALLOWS FULL-SERVICE HOTELS TO BE ON THE FIRST FLOOR WHICH MEANS THERE IS A FULL-SERVICE KITCHEN AND ALSO 40 SQUARE FEET OF CONFERENCE SPACE PER ROOM. HOWEVER, BECAUSE THE RITZ CHARLES IS RIGHT NEXT TO THIS PROJECT, JUST TO THE SOUTH OF IT, IT WOULD BE REDUNDANT TO HAVE A LARGE AMOUNT OF CONFERENCE SPACE IN THIS HOTEL WHEN YOU HAVE A SPECIFIC CONFERENCE CENTER JUST TO YOUR SOUTH.

THE SAME REQUEST WAS MADE BY THE HYATT PLACE HOTEL SOUTH OF THE RITZ BACK IN 2015 TO 2017. THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS APPROVED THE REQUEST FOR THE USE VARIANCE TO HAVE THE HOTEL ON ALL FLOORS, AND THAT WAS IN 2018.

THEN THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN FOR THIS SITE WHICH IS THE HOTEL AND THE OFFICE BUILDING, THAT IS NORTH OF THIS HOTEL... CAME FORWARD IN 2019. AND THEN EVERYBODY KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED IN 2020. THE PANDEMIC CAME, AND MANY PROJECTS TOOK A HIT. AND A LOT OF PROJECTS WERE PUT ON HOLD. AND A LOT OF THINGS DIDN'T HAPPEN FOR A LONG TIME. SO THEY ARE NOW BACK.

THEY ARE READY TO MOVE FORWARD. WITH THIS HOTEL.

THERE WERE OTHER PREVIOUS VARIANCE APPROVALS GRANTED IN 2019, IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN.

OF THE MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING. AND THIS SITE.

AND AGAIN, THE MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING IS NOW CONSTRUCTED.

IT IS NOW OCCUPIED. THERE HAS BEEN FORWARD PROGRESS ON THIS SITE, EVEN THROUGH THE PANDEMIC.

THOSE VARIANCES ARE FOR A SIDE YARD, BUILDING WITH PERCENTAGE, AND PARKING LOT SETBACKS ON THE SHARED PROPERTY LINE WHICH IS BETWEEN THE TWO BUILDINGS. SO IN FRONT OF US TODAY IS FIVE STORIES 126 ROOMS, WITH A MAIN ENTRANCE P FACING WEST AND THE MAIN DROP-OFF AREA FACING WEST. AND THAT IS THE SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT PLAN COMPARED TO THE USE VARIANCE WHICH HAD THE DROP-OFF AND THE ENTRANCE ON TE NORTH SIDE OF THE HOTEL.

[02:05:05]

IT IS A MATERIAL THAT WE TYPICALLY SEE AS A CORNIS MATERIAL OR ACCENT MATERIAL. IT IS LIGHTWEIGHT.

IT IS EASY TO SHAPE AND MAKE IT INTO DIFFERENT SHAPES.

BRICK AND STONE ARE PROPOSED ON THE FIRST FLOOR WITH EFIS ON THE SECOND THROUGH FIFTH FLOORS. AND WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH THE PETITIONER TO MAKE CHANGES TO THE DESIGN TO SEE LESS EFIS AND MORE BRICK AND STONE WHICH ARE CONSIDERED MORE LONG-LASTING AND DURABLE MATERIALS. THE CORRIDOR DISTRICT REQUIRES THAT ALL FACADES ARE PRIMARY FACADES.

WHICH MEANS THEY ARE ARCHITECTURALLY SIGNIFICANT AND DETAILED WITH ORNAMENTATION. RIGHT NOW, WE DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THE BUILDING DESIGN MEETS THIS REQUIREMENT AMONG OTHERS THAT ARE LISTED IN THE REPORT. SOME THINGS WE TYPICALLY LOOK FOR ARE FOR A CONSISTENT BASE, A MIDDLE AND A TOP TO THE BUILDINGS WITH MATERIAL CHANGES HORIZONTALLY.

GENERALLY SPEAKING. HERE, NOT ONLY DO THE COLORS OF THE MATERIAL CHANGE VERTICALLY, BUT ALSO THE STONE MATERIAL OR THE BRICK MATERIAL BENEATH THEM ALSO CHANGES ALONG THE FACADE.

GENERALLY, I MEAN, WE HAVE SUPPORTED MORE MODERN-LOOKING BUILDINGS, AND I THINK I UNDERSTAND HOW THE PETITIONER MAY HAVE MISUNDERSTOOD WHAT I HAVE SHOWN THEM AS FAR AS, LIKE, OTHER TRU HOTELS. YOU KNOW, SOME ARE VERY PLAIN.

PROBABLY BECAUSE OF THOSE CITIES' REQUIREMENTS.

SOME ARE REALLY BOLD. I THINK WE COULD SUPPORT SOMETHING BOLD HERE AS LONG AS WE HAD MORE LONG-LASTING MATERIALS, MORE MASONRY MATERIALS ON THIS FACADE.

SOME OF THE OTHER ITEMS THAT ARE UNKNOWN LISTED IN THE DEPARTMENT REPORT THAT WE NEEDED MORE DETAILING ON SUCH AS THE BICYCLE PARKING, BOTH SHORT AND LONG-TERM.

WE HAD SOME BUILDING LIGHTING QUESTIONS.

SIGNAGE CONCERNS. SIGNAGE CONCERNS FACING THE WEST, THE NEIGHBORHOODS TO THE WEST.

THEY HAVE EXPRESSED CONCERNS ABOUT THE HEIGHT OF THE BUILDING, THE SIGNAGE FACING THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD.

THE LIGHTING LEVELS, IN GENERAL OF THE BUILDING.

SO WE HAVE SOME ISSUES TO WORK THROUGH.

ON THIS PROJECT. SO GENERALLY, WE RECOMMEND THAT THIS WOULD GO TO THE FEBRUARY 7 COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE FOR FURTHER REVIEW AND THE COMMITTEE CAN AUTOMATICALLY HAVE THE POWER TO APPROVE IT BECAUSE IT IS JUST AN ADLS ITEM.

THAT DOES NOT HAVE TO BE APPROVED BY THE FULL COMMISSION.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, RACHEL.

MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION? >> MR. DIERCKMAN?

>> WELL, IT APPEARS TO BE AWFULLY CHEAP-LOOKING TO ME.

TO BE BRUTALLY HONEST. AND THEN I WENT TO THE WEBSITE.

I REALIZED OH, THE ROOMS ARE CHEAP, TOO.

IT ALL KIND OF ADDS UP NOW. YOU KNOW, THIS WHOLE THING IS A BILLBOARD FOR THE HOTEL CHAIN. IT IS IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM, FROM THIS COMMISSIONER'S STANDPOINT, ACCEPTABLE IN THE CITY OF CARMEL. IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT ANYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT BOLD.

YOU CAN DO YOUR TRU... YOU CAN'T CARRY THAT COLOR THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE BUILDING. JUST SPEND A DAY HERE AND DRIVE AROUND. BECAUSE THAT IS NOT GOING TO CUT MUSTARD FOR THIS COMMISSIONER. I MEAN, IT IS SO INCREDIBLY TACKY. LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, IT IS A CHEAP HOTEL. I GUESS THAT IS WHAT YOU GET WHEN YOU GET A CHEAP HOTEL. DOG DON'T HUNT.

YOU HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE DOG AND GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD. IT IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE CARMELIZED. THAT IS AN OLD TERM WE USED TO USE. CARMELIZED.

FRANKLY, I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN ANOTHER PHONE CALLS SAYING, OH, WE NEED ANOTHER HOTEL AND IT HAS TO BE A HILTON TRU. HILTON IS A NICE BRAND AND EVERYTHING. WE KNOW THE PRITZKERS AND ALL THAT HISTORY AND SO FORTH. JUST DON'T CARE THAT MUCH.

CARMELIZE. >> MR. AASEN?

>> THANK YOU. YEAH.

I SHARE SOME CONCERNS THAT WE WANT TO KIND OF GET THE DESIGN A

[02:10:02]

WITH SOME OF THE OTHER HOTELS IN THE AREA.

I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR MSH ABOUT THE SIGNAGE... HEAR MORE ABOUT THE SIGNAGE. AND KIND OF WHAT THE COMMISSIONER HAS PLANNED IF THE BZA IS NOT IN FAVOR FOR THE VARIANCE FOR THE SIGNAGE AS PROPOSED.

I WANT TO HEAR MORE ABOUT THIS AGREEMENT FOR PARKING WITH RITZ CHARLES. IT SOUNDS LIKE IT WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS... THE CITY WAS INITIALLY HAPPY WITH.

SOMEHOW, IT HAS CHANGED TO BE DECREASED BY AT LEAST TEN SPACES. WITH THIS AGREEMENT, IS IT SHARED? I MEAN THERE, HAS BEEN TIMES I HAVE BEEN AT EVENTS AT THE RITZ CHARLES, WHERE ALL OF THEIR SPOTS ARE FULL. HOW DO THEY ANTICIPATE KIND OF NAVIGATING THAT? DO YOU HAVE SOME MORE DETAILS

YOU CAN SHARE WITH US ON THAT? >> YES.

SO THIS PROJECT HAS A LOT OF HISTORY, AND THERE IS A LOT OF PARTS THAT HAPPENED IN THE PAST. THERE WAS TALK AT ONE POINT, THE OF A PARKING GARAGE ON THE BACK HALF OF THE RITZ.

THE RITZ'S PROPERTY. AND SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE MINUTES AND THE APPROVAL FROM THE BZA FOR THE USE VARIANCE, IT TALKS ABOUT BEING OPEN TO THE SITE LAYOUT AND THINGS MAY CHANGE BECAUSE WE REALLY WANTED TO ENCOURAGE A MORE DENSEIFICATION OF THIS SITE WITH TOWNHOMES WRAPPING IN THE PARKING GARAGE THAT WAS PROPOSED.

ALL OF THAT FELL APART AND DID NOT MOVE FORWARD.

SO THE HYATT PLACE TO THE SOUTH, HAS, I THINK, ABOUT 12 PARKING SPACES OFFICIALLY ON THE SOUTH END THAT THE RITZ HAS AGREED TO LET THEM USE. AND THEN ON THIS PART, OF THE SITE, THE RITZ AGREED TO HAVE SHARED PARKING WITH THE TWO USERS. THE OFFICE BUILDING AND THE HOTEL. AND BASICALLY, I KIND OF WENT THROUGH THE NUMBERS IN THE REPORT.

THE INITIAL SITE PLAN APPROVED AS PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN THAT IS NOW UP ON THE SCREEN, ROTATING THE ENTRANCE TO THE WEST HAS REDUCED THE OVERALL PARKING ON THIS PART OF THE SITE BY TEN SPACES. AND I GUESS I'M ASKING THE SAME QUESTION AS YOU. IS THE RITZ OKAY WITH THAT? DO WE NEED AN UPDATED PLAN FROM THEM? OR AGREEMENT FROM THEM? THAT THEY CAN HANDLE TEN MORE SPACES? OR IS IT PERHAPS THAT THE OFFICE BUILDING TO THE NORTH BEING OFF HOURSES IS OKAY WITH, YOU KNOW, TAKING ON THOSE TEN SPACES. IT IS JUST A LOT OF UNKNOWN

QUESTIONS. >> YEAH.

I JUST ENCOURAGE THE PETITIONER TO ASK THOSE QUESTIONS.

WE HAVE WANT YOU TO BE SUCCESSFUL.

WE YANT YOU TO HAVE A GOOD EXPERIENCE WITH PARKING.

IF WE CAN HELP MAYBE RAISE SOME OF THOSE QUESTIONS AND ENCOURAGE YOU TO GO THROUGH THOSE WHAT-IFS WITH SURROUNDING NEIGHBORS AND SPECIFICALLY, THE RITZ CHARLES FOR WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THEY'VE ARE ALSO BUSY, HOW DO YOU KIND OF NEGOTIATE THAT WITH THEM? I JUST ENCOURAGE YOU TO MAYBE HAVE THOSE DISCUSSIONS SOONER

RATHER THAN LATER. >> DUBBIE?

>> DITTO AND DITTO. I HAVE BEEN TO EVENTS AT THE RITZ, AND PARKING ALREADY IS AN ISSUE.

I HAVE HAD TO PARK AT THE HYATT AND WAS ONLY ABLE TO DO BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T AT CAPACITY. BUT IF THE HYATT IS EVER AT CAPACITY, AND THE RITZ HAS A LARGE EVENT, I JUST KNOW FROM EXPERIENCE, PARKING IS GOING TO BE A PROBLEM.

I'M CURIOUS... I'M UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS DOESN'T FALL UNDER OUR PURVIEW RIGHT NOW. I'M CURIOUS WITH THE RITZ ENTRANCE BEING ON THE EAST. CORRECT? THE HYATT'S ENTRANCE IS ON THE NORTH.

>> THE HYATT IS THE HOTEL SOUTH OF THOSE?

>> THE HOTEL TO THE SOUTH. BUT THE ENTRANCE TO HYATT IS ON THE NORTHTH SIDE OF THE HOTEL TO THE SOUTH OF THE RITZ.

>> OH, YES. I'M SORRY.

THE PEDESTRIAN ENTRANCE. >> I'M CURIOUS WHY THE ENTRANCE WOULD BE ON THE WEST SIDE FOR THIS HOTEL, AND WHILE YOU ARE CHECKING, THE HEIGHT OF THE HYATT, JUST TO REFRESH MY MEMORY, HOW MANY STORIES IS THAT?

>> I THOUGHT IT WAS FOUR. THAT IS WHAT I THOUGHT.

>> I WILL LOOK. >> I THINK IT IS FOUR.

THIS WOULD BE FIVE. I ECHO MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER'S

[02:15:03]

CHEAP. >> SUE?

>> WHEN THIS CAME THROUGH, I REMEMBER WE WERE APPROVING A DEVELOPMENT PLAN, IF I REMEMBER RIGHT, WHERE IT WAS SO VAGUE, BECAUSE THAT IS ALL IT WAS. IT WAS A MEDICAL BUILDING.

AND A HOTEL. AND IT WAS NOT A REAL COMFORTABLE THING FOR ME TO APPROVE IT WITH SO LITTLE NINE.

... WITH SO LITTLE KNOWN. I UNDERSTAND PROCEDURE.

AND THERE IS NOT A PUBLICHEARIN. THIS IS GOING TO BE APPROVED AT COMMITTEE. I'M KIND OF SURPRISED AT THAT.

WAS THIS APPROVED FOR FIVE STORIES BACK THEN?

>> YES. >> IT WAS UP TO SNIEF IF THEY WENT TO FOUR, THEY WOULDN'T NEED AS MUCH PARKING.

IT WOULD BE MORE BALANCED WITH WHAT YOU SEE THERE.

OBVIOUSLY, THAT IS LOSS OF INCOME.

IF YOU GO TO FOUR. SINCE YOU CAN BUILD ON THE FIRST FLOOR, I WOULD LIKE FOR YOU TO LOOK AT THAT.

>> YES. MR. DIERCKMAN? PARKING. ME UP TO SPEED ON THE- I GUESS I'M CONFUSED ON THAT.

THEY HAVE A VARIANCE ALREADY? ON THE PARKING FOR A NUMBER OF SPACES BUT YET THEY CAN'T FI FILL... MAKE ROOM FOR THOSE SPACES? IS THAT WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?

>> YES. THEY HAVE APPROVAL TO HAVE SHARED PARKING WITH THE RITZ, AND THAT IS ALLOWED PER THE UDO, NOT BY VARIANCE. IF YOU HAVE JOINT PARKING BETWEEN USES WITHIN 300 FEET OF YOUR SITE, YOU CAN HAVE A SHARED PARKING AGREEMENT. FOR INSTANCES LIKE THIS WHERE WE WANT THE DENSEIFICATION AND OFF OUR USES CAN SHARE PARKING.

THAT WAS APPROVED. HOWEVER, NOW THEY HAVE CHANGED THE SITE PLAN, AND TEN SPACES ARE GONE.

SO THAT IS WHAT I'M ASKING THEM TO RE-LOOK AT WITH THE RITZ AND MAKING SURE THAT THEY STILL BELIEVE THAT THE CAPACITY IS THERE. BECAUSE THE TEN SPACES THAT THEY USED TO HAVE ON THEIR SITE WITH THE ENTRANCE TO THE NORTH ARE

NOW GONE. >> YEAH.

WELL, I'M CONFUSED. THEY SHOULD HAVE A STATED NUMBER OF PARKING SPOTS THAT THEY ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE.

AND THEY SHOULD BE REQUIRED TO BUILD THOSE PARKING SPACES.

SO WHAT IS THE CONFUSION WITH THOSE TWO POINTS?

BECAUSE... >> THEY ARE ASKING TO CHANGE IT

NOW. >> WHAT IS THAT?

>> THEY ARE ASKING TO CHANGE IT. WITH THIS DIFFERENT SITE PLAN.

THEY ARE BEFORE YOU NOW WITH A SLIGHTLY MODIFIED SITE PLAN, AND THEY ARE ALLOWED TO DO THAT, TO ASK YOU TO CHANGE.

>> YEAH. WE ARE UNDERPARKED ALREADY IN THIS SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES. WE ARE ONLY GOING TO PROMOTE A PROBLEM THAT MAKING A SMALL... MAKING A SMALL PROBLEM OR SOMEWHAT OF A PROBLEM A BIGGER PROBLEM.

>> I UNDERSTAND. >> AND I DON'T THINK THAT YOU ALL SHOULD BE GOING AND TALKING TO THESE OTHER PEOPLE ABOUT THE NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES THEY ARE ALLOWING... OR THEY ARE WILLING TO LET IN AT THIS HOTEL. EVERY ONE OF THESE INDEPENDENT BUSINESSES NEED TO HAVE ENOUGH PARKING FOR THEIR OWN PURPOSES.

INDEPENDENT OF EACH OTHER. NOW, PERHAPS THE MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING, BUT IF THERE IS AN EVENT GOING ON AT THE RITZ CHARLES, YOU KNOW, BOTH OF THOSE HOTELS AND THE RITZ CHARLES PARKING SPOTS ARE GOING TO BE FILLED TO THE SEAMS. THEY ARE GOING TO BE JAM-PACT. EVERYBODY IS GOING TO BE HEADED OVER TO THE AT&T BUILDING. I JEWELED TO PARK THERE... I USED TO PARK THERE ALL THE TIME. I HOPED MY CAR WAS NEVER TOWED.

THE SIGNS WERE INTIMIDATING. I HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE PARKING MORE WITH THIS THING ALSO. THIS DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME.

WHERE THESE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO PARK IN THIS INSTANCE.

>> SO WITH RESPECT TO YOUR LISTING EXERCISE, THANK YOU FOR PHRASING IT THAT WAY. AS YOU DRIVE UP AND DOWN THE CORRIDOR, YOU SEE A VARIETY OF ARCHITECTURE AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, A VARIETY OF VINTAGES OF ARCHITECTURE STARTING IN THE EARLY 80S. WHEN RED BRICK WAS... NOTHING BUT RED BRICK WAS THE RAGE. TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY WITH MORE

[02:20:07]

WHEN MR. DIERCKMAN TALKS ABOUT CARMELIZE IT, THAT IS HOW I INTERPRET THAT OBJECTIVE. I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU THAT WAY, AT THE SAME TIME, I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE DEPARTMENT TO STRETCH SOME AND, YOU KNOW, HELP US MOVE INTO THE 2020S ARCHITECTURALLY AND TECHNOLOGICALLY.

FROM THE RED BRICK AND BROWN WINDOWS OF THE EARLY 80S.

AND COME UP WITH SOMETHING THAT TELLS VISITORS FROM OUT OF TOWN THIS IS A PROGRESSIVE CITY AND THAT THIS IS AN INNOVATIVE CITY.

AND A COOL CITY. WITHOUT BEING CHEAP OR GARISH.

THERE IS YOUR MARCHING ORDERS, I GUESS.

>> I THINK IT IS WHEN YOU START TYING IN THE SIGNAGE COLORS INTO THE BUILDING ITSELF AND UNDERNEATH THE CANOPY, AND ALONG

THE STRETCH... >> RIGHT.

WE DON'T DO MCDONALD'S STORES THAT ARE RED AND YELLOW.

>> IN THE ARCHITECTURE. WE KNOW WHAT'S TRYING TO BE ACHIEVED. YOU ARE TRYING TO CREATE A

BILLBOARD FOR THE BRAND. >> CORRECT.

>> THAT IS WHAT'S NOT GOING TO WORK FOR YOU IN THIS TOWN.

LOOK AT... I DON'T LIKE THE RED BRICK EITHER.

WE HAVE THE BEST-LOOKING LOWES IN THE WORLD.

IT IS AT 146TH AND KEYSTONE. THAT IS THE KIND OF EXPECTATIONS WE HAVE FOR OUR, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE THAT WANT TO HANG OUT IN THIS TOWN. AND DO HIGH-QUALITY FINISHES.

AND MAKE IT LOOK APPROPRIATE FOR THE COMMUNITY THAT YOU ARE RESIDING. IN WE ARE LOOKING FOR GOOD

NEIGHBORS HERE. >> SO WHAT I'M HEARING IS PARKING SUFFICIENCY, YOU KNOW BALLENS LAST... BALANCING THAT WITH NOT BEING OVERPARKED. THAT IS AN OBJECTIVE OF THE COMP PLAN, AND OF THE CITY. WE DON'T WANT FIELDS OF PARKING.

I THINK TODAY THAT OFTEN IS THE CASE ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE RITZ CHARLES. IT IS A PARKING LOT THAT SITS EMPTY AND A SEA OF ASPHALT. BUT THERE ARE ALSO THOSE FRIDAY AND SATURDAY NIGHTS WHERE THERE IS SEVERAL BIG EVENTS AT THE RITZ, AND THE HOTEL CAN BE FULL OF ATHLETES AT GRAND PARK AND THAT OPPORTUNITY TO SHARE THE PARKING DOESN'T EXIST BECAUSE THE LOT IS FULL FROM USERS FOR TWO ENTIRELY DIFFERENT REASONS INSTEAD OF TWO COMPLEMENTARY REASONS.

I GUESS IF THERE IS A THEME TONIGHT, IT IS THAT BALANCING ACT ARCHITECTURALLY. AND THE BALANCING ACT IN TERMS OF PARKING SUFFICIENCY. WITHOUT BEING EXCESSIVE.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS FROM MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION FOR THE PETITIONER? THEN A MOTION?

WOULD BE IN ORDER. >> DID YOU WANT TO SPEAK FIRST?

>> I DID. I WANTED TO SAY THANK YOU.

YOU MIGHT THINK YOU WERE KIND OF ROUGH ON US.

BUT THIS IS ACTUALLY WHAT WE NEEDED TO HEAR.

>> YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ROUGH. >> WHOA.

(LAUGHTER) NO. ACTUALLY, THIS IS WHAT WE NEEDED TO HEAR. I TRULY THANK YOU.

. >> GREAT.

THANK YOU. >> I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO SEND THIS TO THE COMMERCIAL COMMITTEE BUT TO COME BACK TO THE PLAN

COMMISSION FOR THE FINAL VOTE. >> SECOND.

>> ALL IN FAVOR, AGAIN, MEETING NEXT ON FEBRUARY 7 WITH FINAL AUTHORITY RESERVED TO THE FULL PLAN COMMISSION, SAY AYE.

>> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? THAT IS THE PATH IT WILL TAKE, THEN.

GREAT. THANK YOU, GENTLEMEN.

>> THANK YOU. >> AGAIN, FOR THE COMMISSIONERS, THE COMMITTEE ROSTERS ARE COMMERCIAL.

COMMISSIONERS AASEN, DIERCKMAN, KIRSH AND ZOCCOLA AND THE RESIDENTIAL COMMITTEE COMMISSIONERS BUCKLER, CAMPAGNA, HILL, AND WESTERMEIER. AND COMMISSIONERS KIRSH AND HILL ARE REMINDED THAT T THEIR ABSENS SUBJECT THEM TO THE POSSIBILITY OF FURTHER VOLUNTEERING FOR OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES.

SO AT THEIR OWN PERIL. THERE BEING NO OTHER BUSINESS FOR THE COMMISSION, THEN WE WILL BE ADJOURNED.

[02:25:01]